DRAWN TO MAYHEM
Filmmaker is not a huge fan of comic books, but he sees Joker’s appeal
Todd Phillips wants to get something out of the way really quickly, just so there’s no confusion. He isn’t a huge comic book guy.
Phillips, who co-writes and directs Joker, was keen to tackle the Batman villain because if there’s one thing he’s been interested in throughout his whole artistic life, it’s mayhem.
“I always was attracted to the Joker character,” he says.
“I liked his representation of mayhem and when I started thinking about comic book movies in general, and how they’re spectacular and gigantic and how they have the world’s attention, I just started thinking about how you could really use that genre in a different way.”
So along with co-writer Scott Silver, Phillips, 48, who became a household name after directing the three Hangover movies, Old School, Starsky & Hutch and War Dogs, pitched Warner Bros. a standalone origin tale for one of comicdom’s most iconic characters. Q Working on a film like Joker comes with a lot of fan expectations. How did you deal with that going into the film?
A I had no experience with something like this. The closest experience I had to expectations like this was Hangover II. With that, we were following up a massive hit. But I didn’t have experience with the comic book audience, who with every nugget they hear there’s a debate about it for four days on Twitter. So it was an overwhelming experience to run that gauntlet, so to speak.
Q How did you settle in on Joaquin Phoenix for your lead? So far in his career, he has avoided these types of films.
A I’ve been a fan of Joaquin forever. His performances over the years have been jaw-dropping. I knew he’d be a hard person to get because we all know the kinds of films he gravitates toward. It’s not like Joaquin doesn’t get offered big movies, he just chooses to do the movies he wants to do. So for me and Scott that was the challenge. We had to write something that he couldn’t say no to. Q The movie is influenced by ’70s crime dramas and you cast Robert De Niro, whose DNA is in a lot of those titles, including Taxi Driver. How did he react to what you were doing? He too is an actor who hasn’t done any comic book films.
A He doesn’t — that’s a great point. Every move we made with this movie, every time we would get stuck, we always asked ourselves, ‘What’s the bold choice here?’ and if not bold choice, ‘What’s the weird choice?’ With De Niro, it was, ‘What’s the bold choice?’ We sent it to him and he read it and dug it and got it. He was into it as it references Rupert Pupkin, the character he plays in King of Comedy, but that’s not why he did it. I think he dug what the movie was ultimately saying.
Q Phoenix goes to some pretty dark places with Arthur/joker. Were you surprised at his fearlessness as an actor?
A People have asked me: what’s the one event that turns him into Joker? There is no one event. When you watch the movie, it’s this slow transformation. I compare it on a stereo going from 1 to 11. You turn the knob up slow, slow, slow … it’s a slow burn. The whole movie we’re turning that knob and Joaquin is slowing ratcheting up a little more and a little more. I just think it’s a masterful performance from him. He’s just wild.
Q Among all comic book villains, Joker is one of the most feared and revered. Why does he endure?
A I think it’s because he represents this anarchic spirit that’s in everybody, but we don’t act on it because we’re normal. There’s something about him not caring at all. One of the things I loved about (Heath Ledger’s Joker), I loved his attitude: He just wants to watch the world burn. Personally, I don’t want to watch the world burn, but I like that character’s attitude. He wasn’t after money, he wasn’t after women, he just wanted to f--- s--up. He wanted chaos, and there’s something about Joker being this agent of chaos that I think is exciting to watch.