It Will Leave When It Tastes as Bitter as Poison

Questioner: Even after attaining this Gnan, if that [sweetness] arises within or the effects that are still remaining within, how can all of those be settled?

Dadashri: As long as they taste as bitter as poison, they will continue to discharge.

Questioner: Meaning that from wherever one is taking security ( hoonf), whichever dependencies ( avalamban) one may have taken in the past or one is taking at present, they should all taste as bitter as poison?

Dadashri: If you find them to be bitter, then you will definitely become free of them. As many circumstances as there are, there are that many dependencies.

Questioner: There can also be another way to become free of the dependencies, isn’t it? Meaning that, they can even fall away through the awareness of Gnan, can they not?

Dadashri: If the awareness of Gnan prevails, then there is no dependency, is there!

Questioner: There is no dependency there at all?

Dadashri: It is because he still has a habit of dwelling in the other [the non-Self].

Questioner: He finds that to be sweet. What could possibly be the greater cause for dependencies [to arise]?

Dadashri: It is because of desires.

Questioner: That is fine, but which ones are the dependencies that create obstructions? For example, the dependency on the home, or the dependency on the wife?

Dadashri: Hey, that cannot actually be calculated.

Questioner: If not them, then what?

Dadashri: Actually, that is a big one. We have just talked about one circle, where there might be five to seven circumstances. A wife, a house; there can be ten million such circumstances. One has not limited himself to just a woman, one has gone everywhere. One has only five to seven circumstances. But from that moment on, He can be referred to as niralamb (free of dependency on anything relative). Even if He has five to seven circumstances!

Questioner: Does that mean that He would have attained the niralamb state to a certain extent?

Dadashri: From the moment One becomes niralamb, One can See Himself. To be able to See is not in the form of words. Words are actually a dependency.

Questioner: Would One be aware that He has been seized by dependency?

Dadashri: ‘He’ can Know everything indeed.

Questioner: So, what is the solution to become free?

Dadashri: ‘One’ should feel it [the dependency] to be as bitter as poison. Would You not Know what tastes sweet and what tastes bitter?

Questioner: Therefore, wherever the sweetness or bitterness is felt, the dependencies are still intact.

Dadashri: Circumstances are nothing but a dependency.

Questioner: But even You encounter circumstances, yet, Yours is a niralamb state; how is that so?

Dadashri: ‘We’ actually do not have any need for the circumstances, and these ones that ‘we’ are encountering, ‘we’ are settling them.

Questioner: What do you mean? Are you saying that the circumstances you are encountering today are the effects of certain dependencies of the past life?

Dadashri: They are an effect of the desires.

Questioner: Of the past life?

Dadashri: Today, the desire no longer remains, and the circumstances do end up coming together now, as an effect of the desires in the past life, but ‘we’ find them to be as bitter as poison, ‘we’ don’t like them.

Questioner: So, as they get settled [with equanimity], will the niralamb state arise in greater proportion?

Dadashri: For ‘us’ that state has already been attained.

Questioner: But, the settlement of those circumstances...

Dadashri: They are certainly being settled, because One is Seeing every circumstance, One becomes the Knower

Seer! Nevertheless, even if a few are not Seen, yet One will have Seen His real form as the Self. And based on that, He can completely destroy all circumstances, otherwise He would not be able to do so, would He?

Questioner: It is only when One can See His own real form as the Self that the dependency will not remain in the form of a dependency, right?

Dadashri: From the moment One is able to See His own Self, He becomes niralamb. At present, He has come into the circle of ‘I am pure Soul.’

Questioner: All of our mahatmas?

Dadashri: Yes.

Questioner: Yes; this state as the pure Soul is a state that can also bring One into the niralamb state, isn’t it? Therefore, as the files start to get settled [with equanimity], then as a result, does that niralamb state start to arise?

Dadashri: Yes.

Questioner: You mentioned that there are two kinds of dependency: One is dependency that gives a sweet taste and the other is dependency that gives a bitter taste. Is that correct?

Dadashri: Tw o kinds of circumstances certainly exist, do they not?

Questioner: Yes. So, these two kinds of dependency, they arise within; but if One himself moves away from them, then can He move towards the niralamb state?

Dadashri: But how can He move away from them?

Questioner: Through the awareness of this Gnan. The circumstances may be there on the outside, but what if He were to move away from within, in accordance with the awakened awareness?

Dadashri: But how can He move away [from them]? If He can remain as the Knower-Seer, only then would it be considered as Him having moved away [from them].

Questioner: Because today, even You have worldly interactions ( vyavahaar) and circumstances around You; it is the same for the mahatmas too, but it seems as if there is something in the middle which can keep You in the niralamb state.

Dadashri: ‘ We’ prevail as the Knower-Seer ( Gnata-Drashta).

Questioner: That very state.

Dadashri: ‘We’ remain vitaraag ( absolutely free of attachment and abhorrence).

Questioner: So, how can one tell whether or not One has remained in the Knower-Seer state?

Dadashri: One Himself, will Know that. He will say, “I did not remain as the Knower-Seer.”

Questioner: You had also said, “As ‘we’ had Seen the real form as the Self, that is why the niralamb state could prevail on this side.” So, is it also the same with regard to the Knowing-Seeing ( Gnata-Drashtapana)?

Dadashri: ‘ One’ Himself can recognize the Knower-Seer state. ‘You’ are able to Know that, aren’t You? ‘You’ Know whether You are remaining in upayog (applied awareness as the Self), You Know where the upayog remains, You Know all that.

Questioner: So, what I wanted to ask is, for One to prevail in the function of Knowing-Seeing and to have Seen One’s own real form as the Self, are these two states one and the same or is there a difference between the two?

Dadashri: They are different. Every person can remain as the Knower-Seer, isn’t it!

Questioner: So, that other [state] is much higher.

Dadashri: No one has [Seen] such a state.

Questioner: What do you mean? None of our mahatmas have [Seen] It?

Dadashri: They cannot have [Seen] It. And there is no need for that either. Why ask unnecessarily! When life is without any tension, the liberated laughter arises, then all of that comes together. Only after that can the real form as the Self ( Swaroop) be Seen. It is not such a simple thing to attain! First, You have to prevail in the Agnas. Understanding is a different thing and prevailing in the Agnas is a different thing. That is all; there is nothing else.

For now, just remain in the Agnas. And then its result will come when it comes! Right now, if one is studying in the first standard, would he unnecessarily