Nature’s Tumbling Barrel

It is the law of nature that over the course of one million years, nine Vasudev (the one who has evolved from being an ordinary human into becoming a God) and nine Prativasudev (a rival of the Vasudev) are born. On one side, a Narayan ( God) is born and on the other side, a Pratinarayan (a rival of the Narayan) is born. This happens only for the purpose of fighting each other. So then history gets created. Otherwise, what would people read if there were no history? Would there be a Mahabharat (ancient Hindu epic) for them to read? If Ram’s wife had never been kidnapped [in the Hindu epic Ramayan], then what would people read about?

Questioner: So is it necessary to fight just so that people can read about it?

Dadashri: No, it is something for these people to consume. Reading is a food for these people. People need food, don’t they! So Naarad [a sage and storyteller in Hindu epics] is also needed in order to cause an argument; he really makes both sides fight! All of these things are needed. These are all vitamins.

Questioner: But there is complete destruction in all of this. Now, we are able to derive happiness here peacefully, but if there are quarrels going on between people, if people are being killed, then what happiness is there in that? This is exactly what is going on in this universe!

Dadashri: What are you referring to as happiness? If you had to stay at a wedding for 15 days, then what would you do?

Questioner: I would become bored.

Dadashri: So what are you referring to as happiness ( anand)?

Questioner: There is talk about meritocracy going around and America is against it.

Dadashri: Is it on the basis of merit?

Questioner: Everything should carry on like that.

Dadashri: So on what basis is it functioning right now?

Questioner: Not on the basis of equality, but it should function on the basis of merit.

Dadashri: No, but on what basis is it currently functioning?

Questioner: It is currently indeed functioning on the basis of merit.

Dadashri: So then where did you find this new way of functioning?

Questioner: I had just found out about that. This was a new thought I had just now.

Dadashri: How so?

Questioner: All this time we had communism, then we talked about socialism, and then about Gandhism; we have talked a bit about some of these. Now the new thought is about meritism, which means that everyone should live according to their own merits. So I accept this concept. Just as what you said earlier.

Dadashri: That is fine. When one ‘ism’ goes away, a new ‘ism’ is created. When that goes away, then another ‘ism’ is created. But the number of ‘isms’ certainly remain the same; they do not increase. All the ‘isms’ are part of a round.

Questioner: It is only then that worldly life functions, isn’t it!

Dadashri: The ‘ism’ is round, so when one goes away, another arises. Then that goes away and a third one arises, but it is the very same thing. It was the very same the whole time! The very same thing is going around in a circle. Did you understand?

Questioner: It is an orderly arrangement.

Dadashri: People keep thinking that it is new. Every day, something happens that makes people think it is new, otherwise people would not like anything at all! They would not be able to relax, would they! They need history, they need fighting, they need the Mahabharat; they need everything.

Questioner: It is just like they want to see stunts and dancing in movies.

Dadashri: Yes, in that they need

Christ, they need a prophet, they need Mahavir, they need Ram. They even need Ram’s wife, Sita, to be kidnapped. All the necessities are there, otherwise what would people read?

Questioner: It is fine for the purposes of reading, but what is the need for arguing with each other? Why are they fighting in the name of religion?

Dadashri: Have you never been to a blacksmith?

Questioner: I have been to a blacksmith.

Dadashri: He heats up the iron and strikes it with an iron tool. Why is he making the iron ‘fight’ against the iron?

Questioner: He is molding it.

Dadashri: He is molding its shape. Similarly, this fighting is used to ‘mold’ people. So 8.4 million types of ‘molds’ are being molded as a result of this fighting. So all of this is needed, all of it.

The development is taking place right now. There are factories that smelt iron ore from which they make ornaments this big. These ornaments have small spurs on them. To remove these spurs, they throw them in a tumbling barrel. So they throw them all together in the barrel, which is powered by electricity. ‘Grrrrrr, grrrrr’… They keep tumbling around and as they collide with each other, all the spurs break off. This is how nature’s ‘ tumbling barrel’ is spinning. Once it breaks off all the ‘spurs’ and they are removed [from the ‘barrel’], they become first class [quality].

For some people, their greed has increased to such an extent that if a person were to take away 20 lakh rupees from them, then they would have a breakdown at least once from within. Internally, it would feel as though their blood vessels are about to burst.

But from that, one thought arises for him, ‘There is absolutely no happiness in money.’ So then his tuber of greed starts [dissolving]. These are the types of laws of nature. It gives rise to these tubers at first, makes them larger, and then they dissolve. It gives rise to them, makes them larger, gives him the taste of it, and then it gives him the taste as it makes [ the tuber] dissolve. Nature is helping everyone develop. It makes them undergo all kinds of experiences. It makes one go from being partial to being impartial. People outside of India are not too involved in partiality. They are gradually becoming partial as they develop. Upon having become partial, now start becoming impartial. This is because whenever one wants to purify gold, it has to be placed in a furnace. So there is no ‘furnace’ like the one here anywhere in the world. The ‘furnace’ is in India. All that comes here is ready to get purified, and if we were to shout out, “Hey! Do you not want to become purified?” Then they would reply, “Yes, I want to become purifi ed.” Then go inside the ‘furnace’. This is a ‘furnace’! Then ‘we’ pull you out of the ‘furnace’. One will come across those who will

take him out of the ‘furnace’. But even then, they still remain in the ‘furnace’. Day and night, the externally-induced problems ( upadhi) never decrease. If he were to try to reduce his disquietude, then on the contrary, it would increase. His restlessness and anxiety increased because he tried to decrease it, he would say.

The Gnani Removes the Last Bit of ‘Dirt’ of Egoism

The egoism of people outside of India is natural and spontaneous ( sahaj). What is their egoism like? If they have to go somewhere, then they have the egoism of going there and where they are not going, they have the egoism of not going there. Whereas Indian people will go where they should not go and where they should go, they will refuse to go! Ours here is all vikalpi egoism [ego laden with wrong belief]. They [non-Indians] have a natural and spontaneous ego. There [outside India] a thief will continue to steal, a swindler will continue to swindle, and a person who is noble will continue to be noble. Whereas here, a noble person will steal and a thief will show nobility. So this country is a strange phenomenon, isn’t it! This is an ‘Indian puzzle’! It is a puzzle that no one can solve! The people outside of India will exhaust their intellect, but they will not find a solution for it. Here, your cousin will tell you, “I won’t be able to lend you my car, my boss is going to be coming!” The entire ego is filled with deceit!

Even the fact that the egoism is increasing is correct; this is because it is a development of a sort. The final degree in college is that of a PhD. However, while there are those who do complete it, not everyone does so. They develop gradually. The fact that their egoism is increasing is also correct. And whatever ritualized activity one carries out is also correct. That increases his ego and through this process, he undergoes all the different experiences and this ultimately leads him to the experience of the Self.

Questioner: Then does the ego leave at the final stage?

Dadashri: Then he will meet a Gnani. The rule is that whatever ‘standard’ the student is in, there will be an appropriate teacher for him.

Amidst all these, those two to four who are in the final ‘grade’ meet a Gnani Purush and end up passing. Until then, this is how they continue to develop.

Questioner: Can we get rid of the ego through our own efforts, or does it happen naturally?

Dadashri: You cannot get rid of it completely. You can get rid of it through your own efforts up to a certain extent. When you wash clothes with soap, the soap leaves behind its residue on the clothes. When you try to remove the residue of the soap by applying Tinopal [a whitening agent], then the Tinopal will leave behind its own residue. But the final residue will not leave through one’s own efforts. The Gnani Purush is needed to remove the final ‘residue’.

When one meets a Gnani Purush, there is liberation; otherwise, there would

be no liberation. Until that happens, the ego continues to break through a series of natural beatings.

The Ego Dissolves Through Familiarity With the Gnani

Questioner: How can the Gnani break the ego?

Dadashri: The Gnani can break the ego in many different ways. He can actually break it very quickly. When a person comes across ‘ us’, when he becomes acquainted with ‘us’, his ego keeps breaking day by day!

Questioner: If we remain in your environment, in your satsang and in your proximity, then is it true that our ego will exhaust quickly?

Dadashri: There is no need to exhaust the ego; the ego has already been exhausted [after taking Gnan]. For you, the discharging ego now remains. Now, through satsang, Your understanding increases, Your Vision, what You See becomes clearer; it becomes unveiled. Yes, for that, you should come in our proximity for three hundred hours, then It [the Gnan] will become ‘full’, like the full moon!

Questioner: The form of the ego that currently exists within me, which ‘ button’ of spiritual effort should be pressed in order to bring it down to zero?

Dadashri: Only that of shuddha upayog (pure applied awareness as the Self). However much shuddha upayog there is, the ego will dissolve to that extent. And after this Gnan is given, what is the condition of the egoism? If it is a very cold day today and a person who makes and sells ice has a lot of ice in store, then he will think, ‘When will it be sold? Where should I store it?’ So he puts it up for sale with a heavy discount, then a merchant will say, “I will stock up on ice.” So he stocks up on the ice. No matter how many bags are piled up, will it increase or decrease? How does it decrease? How does it decrease at night? It continuously keeps melting. So, after this Gnan is given, the ego certainly continues to dissolve. Some people may even tie bags around it, they keep adding sawdust to it. Hey, don’t do that.

There Are Many Stones in the River, but What About Shaligrams?

Questioner: There are many things about the order of this universe that I do not understand. For instance, we came to you and we attained the Knowledge of the Self from you, but why are others unable to attain it?

Dadashri: No, this is not for everyone. This entire universe is in the form of a flow. Since time immemorial, it has been functioning on the basis of this flow. It has been running constantly without even stopping for a moment. Which flow do you see? You see the one of worldly life. You cannot see the other flow. The worldly flow is known through the senses and that flow is constantly flowing.

In the form of a flow means that wherever the river joins the ocean, the water becomes free. As other things come

they will also become free. This entire world is in the form of a flow. So this does not happen suddenly for everyone.

Questioner: Yes, but some reach the edge of the shore whereas others reach the middle of the ocean. Why is that?

Dadashri: That is all based on scientific circumstantial evidence. Not a single parmanu can be changed in this world.

Questioner: This flow continues to flow. Just as the stones are separated on one side in this flow, where each embodied soul is going to reach is vyavasthit. So then does vyavasthit not function in separating the stones in that flow?

Dadashri: Everything is indeed arranged according to vyavasthit. One’s vision has changed and in the process of believing ‘This is mine’ and ‘This is yours,’ the knowledge of vyavasthit became unconnected. That is all in exactness!

Questioner: Some become shaligrams when the circumstance comes, whereas the rest remain the same, so then how is all of that decided? There must be some power working behind that, must there not?

Dadashri: Everything is in accordance with the law of vyavasthit. Nothing of the future can be changed against the law of vyavasthit. They are all just stones; of them, some become shaligrams.

Questioner: Then the question is why do only some stones become shaligrams and others don’t?

Dadashri: There are all the causes and laws of vyavasthit behind that. So this vyavasthit applies to both the non-Self ( jada) and the Self ( Chetan). Vyavasthit does not apply only to the Self.

Why Do Some Attain Moksha and Others Do Not?

Questioner: I still do not understand why of all the embodied souls who come in this flow, why are only some able to attain moksha? Others are not able to, so what circumstances are instrumental behind that? What is the reason behind that?

Dadashri: There is no other reason, this is indeed due to vyavasthit, and that too, it is bound by rules. It is not as though some attain moksha and the others are left behind, there is a rule behind it. The rule is that one is followed by two, two is followed by three, and if three is followed by forty-five, then the world would not accept that. Even nature would not accept it; three has to be followed by four. So everything is according to the rules. There is not a bit of falsehood.

Questioner: So for the embodied soul that becomes liberated, does its merit karma bound in the past help it in attaining liberation?

Dadashri: It is not the merit karma, it is the timing. It becomes liberated according to the rule and we are following that very same path. They followed this very same path, the one we are traversing on. They have indeed traversed down this path and have left. So it is like this for everyone. It is not as though some attain

the prize suddenly; that is not how the world is. Everything is according to the rule, it is in exactness.

The Flow That Stops Through Real Knowledge Leads to Moksha

Questioner: Why do these [conflicts, hardships] come and go for a person? Why does this happen to him? Which element it is that does that to him?

Dadashri: He is not aware that he is flowing in the flow! So he sees whatever passes by and he cannot see what is coming ahead. It is just as a person who is sitting in a car sees only what has passed by but he cannot see what new things are ahead, that is how one is flowing in this flow. The world is an endless flow. One is flowing in this endless flow, but in reality he is not actually flowing, the flow is taking him. But He Himself is the Knower-Seer ( Gnata-Drashta). So there will be externally-induced problems as long as the flow continues. So when this flow stops, it is called moksha.

This is a flow without a beginning. Moreover, it is a natural flow. It is referred to as niyati. It is the flow of niyati. Now, there is unsteadiness in this flow, and it becomes unsteady because one becomes unsteady. When the flow stops and one becomes steady, everything else also becomes steady. The knowledge one has in this flow is relative knowledge. It arises, then gets destroyed, it arises and gets destroyed.

And when the flow ends, one attains real Knowledge. There, One is the real Knowledge and the relative knowledge is an imagination ( kalpana). The point is simple; it needs to be understood.

Questioner: Some of our scriptures say, ‘Only nature decides who and when one will become free.’ I do not quite comprehend that. So is this also in the hands of a living being?

Dadashri: The fact is that nothing is decided and yet it is within the law. So if it were considered to be decided, then these people’s minds would become different. One cannot say that it is decided. What the scriptures have said has affected people’s minds and the saints have further said, “Everything will end up happening; if it is in your destiny ( prarabdha), then it will end up happening.” That is why India is in such a terrible state! You cannot say that it is in one’s destiny. It is like saying, “If you drive a car with caution and with your eyes open, then if you still have an accident, it is destiny.”

Currently, people believe destiny to be just that and that is why this country is in the state that it is in. And the difference between destiny and Purusharth has not been given in this country for thousands of years. I am here to divulge that difference, that line of demarcation. Purusharth starts after one becomes a Purush (the Self). When One attains the Vision as the Self, Purusharth begins.

Questioner: But it is not under our control to be able to attain the Vision as the Self, is it?

Dadashri: It is not in one’s control; until then, he is under the control of his prakruti (the relative self). What is this

Vision as the Self dependent on? When rocks come rolling down, they all go from here to there and from there to here; they collide with each other. They keep colliding with one another and abrade each other. Just as every living being collides with others, one bites another and one kills another, isn’t it! As they continue colliding against each other, when they eventually become ‘rounded’, that is when they attain samkit (the right belief ‘I am pure Soul’).

The Collection of All Experiences: Absolute Knowledge

This world itself has become a puzzle. The reason why is because these living beings are indeed constantly moving in the flow. Since time immemorial, these living beings have been moving in the form of this flow.

Nature has devised it such that the world will never come to an end. Even if God wanted to bring an end to it, it wouldn’t happen! That is why the Lord remained patient and said, “Keep Seeing whatever happens.” And the One who wants to become free will have to exercise this kind of patience. The One who cannot bear this worldly life, if He continues to See whatever goes on, then He will become free. ‘We’ too do the same thing.

The very nature of worldly life is such that scientific circumstantial evidence, meaning nature, keeps doing everything and You should keep Knowing this, that indeed is the path to moksha.

The entire world is indeed headed towards moksha. These are all the necessary supports and evidences on the path to moksha. If he stays on the path to moksha and you also stay on the path to moksha, then by helping one another, you both become helpful to one another! However, all these [ conflicts] are not helpful on the path to moksha. On the contrary, people apply a brake to it by quarrelling. Otherwise, it is the nature of summer to bring about the monsoon from wherever it is. It brings it from wherever it is. As the summer reaches peak time, it pulls in the monsoon. There is nothing to get alarmed about.

So the nature of worldly life is that it takes us to moksha. It pulls moksha [towards us]. The more difficult worldly life becomes, the sooner moksha comes. However, you should not feel beaten down when it becomes difficult; you should remain on the ‘stage’ [stay on the path to liberation]. You should seek out the right solutions, the wrong solutions will cause regression. When there is misery, think of it as a vitamin for the Self. And when there is pleasure, think of it as a vitamin for the body.

This is indeed nature; this flow is indeed moving towards the eternal. After climbing and falling, after experiencing everything, one is to go towards the eternal. One cannot reach there without going through the experiences. Each and every kind of experience needs to be taken. Absolute Knowledge ( keval Gnan) means a collection of all types of experiences. So all these experiences one is undergoing, that is correct.