I would’ve won more with Pirates

At the peak of his powers as a footballer, everyone wanted a piece of Teko Modise. That he has managed to retain his pulling power long after his playing days is a remarkable testament to his legendary status. His name still stirs deep emotions among South African football lovers, some of whom would never be found dead supporting either of Orlando Pirates or Mamelodi Sundowns, the two most notable teams he turned out for. Perhaps it should come as no surprise then, dear reader, that you see the Meadowlands native gracing the pages of your favourite publication for a second week running. Only that this time around, as opposed to last week’s conversation that centred around all things LALIGA, ‘The General’ goes local in this face-to-face interview with Soccer Laduma’s Delmain Faver, straight from Nedbank’s Ya Rona House in Parktown, Johannesburg. Enjoy!

Delmain Faver: Teko, you are a very busy man; last year you had six jobs, and it could be more now. But where do you get the time and energy to do all this?

Teko Modise: Look, I think it’s the work ethic that I always had. From my footballing days, I think that’s one thing that actually helped me. In terms of being able to juggle everything, it’s very, very difficult and don’t ask me, why did I put myself in so many things. I also have a schedule with Mamelodi Sundowns, I have to juggle my personal life, the hotel, the fixtures and the traveling. You need to find some sort of balance (to succeed), but it also helps that I enjoy what I’m doing. I’m very cognisant of the fact I’m very lucky and the fact that brands do not see me as a former footballer, but as a businessperson, a person that they can invest their money in. This is something that I worked hard to get to and now that I’m here, I can’t be complaining. This is what I enjoy doing, I don’t mind it at all.

DF: During your playing days you were not the most mediafriendly person. At which stage did you realise that you needed to engage with the media more?

TM: I think I’m still closed off, to be honest with you. At the time, I always had this love-hate relationship with the media. I think it’s welldocumented for so many years. To get to this position and say, “Maybe it’s time to open up a little bit,” wasn’t a decision that I took. I didn’t know that I wanted to be a pundit, I didn’t know that I wanted to do commentary. I was still trying to figure out what I wanted to do.

DF: Right.

TM: As you mature as a man, you let go of certain things. You know, I let go of being scared to talk to the media or disliking the media. I got to understand that if I had to find some sort of forgiveness within myself, I started to appreciate myself more. Then it became easier to have a conversation with everybody else. I’m content with myself and I think for the most part of my career, I wasn’t. In football, we all know that I was very comfortable and very confident. But from a personal point of view, I wasn’t content with myself, and I didn’t like myself as much.

DF: Why?

TM: I don’t know what is it that I didn’t like much. But once I started liking myself more, not taking myself too seriously, my walls started falling down a little bit. I’m more open now, more receptive of the fact that I need to speak to the media – I have to – I’m part of the media. Yeah, man, it was just a journey that was very difficult because you need to unlearn all the bad habits. But it’s a journey that actually took me years to be able to sit down with you and come and speak to you.

DF: Sitting here as a 41-yearold Teko, what would you say to the guy who is about to become a household name for both Orlando Pirates and Bafana Bafana?

TM: I would definitely say be kind to yourself, have patience, which is something that I’m still struggling with today. But I think most of all I would say be kind, because I wasn’t kind to myself when I was still playing. I was driven, I’m glad I had a drive because I didn’t want to fail, I was scared to fail. I was also very pushy. I was very pushy in a sense that I wanted to win at all costs. I never looked at football as just a game that even after losing I can smile and have a good time. For me it was win at all costs, I had that mentality because I grew up in a system in Diepkloof and Orlando where after winning, we’d split the winnings. So winning was a must because I neede d to use this money to do certain things with it. So that’s the mentality. And also, maybe, I wasn’t open enough because I was scared, I felt that people were goin g to use me.

DF: Mhhh…

TM: I could never have too many football friends and never really had, because I wasn’t open to that, and I think I lost myself in the space as well. It was very difficult for people to invite me to anything because I wasn’t their friend. Not because they spoke about it, but because my demeanour was telling them that we couldn’t be friends. I’m not here to make friendship, I’m here to work and that’s the mentality that I had. Looking back now, it’s not a nice mentality to have. It’s important to be part of the team. It’s important to have a relationship as well, and it’s something that I’ve struggled with. And I think if I had that a little bit earlier, I would have

won more stuff with Orlando Pirates. If I was more open to my teammates because there are certain things that I couldn’t say to my teammates that I knew that I could help them maybe improve their game, and maybe also there were certain things that they could tell me that could also improve my game. But because there was no relationship in between, you don’t know how the other person’s going to receive that. I only learned about being part of a team and the importance of friendship when I got to Mamelodi Sundowns.

DF: One player who has striking similarities to you is Thembinkosi Lorch. He is as closed off as you were, he is a top footballer, and he is finding himself embroiled in negative publicity more often than not. Have you ever spoken to him to help him navigate the terrain a bit better than you did?

TM: We had conversations, to be honest. I think it was just after he won the Footballer of the Year. I’ve always been vocal about being open to have conversation with players because we never had that opportunity to speak to the greats that did it before us. And I’m sure that if we had those opportunities, there are certain things we could have avoided. I got into the space not knowing what ‘superstar’ means, how to carry myself, I didn’t know all those things, I had to learn as I went along. And the first thing that you do as a footballer is that you are sensitive. You always want to be praised, you always want to see yourself in good headlines, once something bad happens, you close off. You always isolate. You always want to see the good things. And if I only knew how to react to the bad things at the time, maybe having a conversation with somebody that has been in that space, I’m sure I could have acted a little bit better.

DF: That’s true, General.

TM: But now that he (Lorch) is at Sundowns, we haven’t had that conversation as yet, but I know the similarity that people see. But when the time comes because the timing needs to be right and once the timing is right, when that happens, I’ll be glad to be very open like I was before because he reached out to me. I will gladly have that conversation and, of course, it would be a private conversation. I have a lot of conversations with footballers and for me now, it’s something that I cherish a lot, because I know how they look at me and the fact that they are able to approach me, it makes me feel a bit better because I was unapproachable when I was still playing. I would love to share my story with him. I know that, right now, he is under a lot of stress because of the competition that he is in, the new club, the adjustment. There are a lot of things happening in his head and once the timing is right, I’m sure that I will have a nice lunch with him and just talk (to him) to see where his head space is at and of course, share my knowledge with him.

DF: One thing that is

constant is your admiration for Doctor Khumalo and your desire to reach and surpass his level. Being where you are at the moment, do you feel like you satisfied the urge to surpass your icon?

TM: Honestly, I never thought about it that way. The reason why I speak about Doctor is because he was in a space where I wanted to be. At the time, in my mind, he was the only person that was capable of being in that space, even though, at the time, I didn’t have a definition of what space that was. But he had the most popular hairstyles, people were doing it, you know, and he was the most loved, he couldn’t do anything wrong, and it was exceptional to watch. What I wanted at the time was to be named in the same sentence as him when it comes to football in South Africa. It’s true when they say fame is a drug, it’s very, very difficult because you can’t switch off. I started studying what is it that he does different to the other guys that he played with. I started learning he’s very private. I started learning how can I incorporate that into my own personality.

DF: Interesting.

TM: It’s insane that Doctor retired 20 years ago but he is still relevant today. If Doctor could do it with so little that he was exposed to at the time, there’s no way that I cannot do it. I just need to change certain things about myself as well. Just trying to align to wherever it is that I wanted to be. For the fact that I can safely

say today that I can pick up the phone and call him, I can be in the same room, have a conversation with him, I think I fulfilled my dream! I don’t have any ambitions to be better than him anymore. I’m just grateful and honoured to be in this space and (for) him to recognise me as that guy because also we never really get opportunities to give people their flowers while they’re still alive. I’ve done that in my book, I’ve done it every time I see him, he knows what it is. And every time I have an opportunity to speak about him, I’ll do it because I am who I am because he made me believe that I can be. Doctor was the first guy to be taken seriously by corporate brands. The fact that now brands are taking me seriously, I just hope that I can do what Doctor did for me as I was coming up. I think that’s the goal now. It’s not to be bigger or better than anyone, it’s just to open the doors that maybe Doctor was unable to open for me because he never had the means. But if I have the means, I want to open doors for other guys as well, so it can be like a ripple effect.

DF: David Beckham owns a MLS team, he has the pull and influence to bring someone as big as Lionel Messi to his club. Do you think in South Africa we’ll get to a level where we can call ourselves football moguls?

TM: It’s going to be very difficult in a sense that the stigma around South African footballers is still bad. It’s guys who never went to school that just chase this round thing. It doesn’t help as well because a lot of stories are coming up, saying footballers did this and that. So, we are always labelled as rebels. It’s easier for David because they can acquire sponsors that can help him out to actually buy a team. He has the voice, the face, the demeanour, he’s got everything going on for him and also because it’s so influential and we all know it started with him. That’s where everything started. Nobody can tell us any other story, it started there, and I think he has the power to influence. And you know in South Africa when you have the power to influence, you intimidate! People get intimidated by your presence. I think that’s the problem.

DF We hear you..

TM: Bra Lucas (Radebe), I love the fact that I think he has been open for the last two years, for such a long time he has been closed off now, now he’s coming out. He’s showing us his personality and that is great to see. Yeah, and I’m always happy when I see him, you know, and I always tease him. Doctor as well, he’s doing his own stuff as well. If those guys can’t do it, it’s going to be very difficult for us to do it because we need somebody to start it for us. David did it and it’s not him only. Ronaldo Nazario also owns a team. If there was a system in South Africa where a team can have shareholders, fans have shares in a team, it would be easier for us to start that because I can’t go to my own community and say, “Guys, let’s start a team,” and then everybody becomes a shareholder. We can do that but in the system in South Africa it hasn’t happened.

STILL CLOSED “I THINK I’M WITH OFF TO BE HONEST TIME, I YOU. AT THE THIS LOVEHATE ALWAYS HAD WITH RELATIONSHIP I THINK IT’S THE MEDIA. WELL-DOCUMENTED.”

DF: True, Donna.

TM: That’s why there’s a lot of teams that don’t have sponsors. Imagine if there was shareholding within the fans like with Man United and Liverpool. This can open so many doors for us, you’ll be able to get into positions because as much as I want to get into a position of administration or an advisory level for the football club – but I can’t because once you walk in, somebody feels intimidated and like you are there for their jobs and the doors are closed. So it becomes very, very difficult to get into those spaces. Yeah, but we are trying to still contribute to football around whatever that we want to do until we find somebody that’s inside there. That’s why there’s calls for former footballers to be involved at SAFA, and maybe if we have one, things will start to change - but once that isn’t happening, you’re still going to be stuck in the same system and the same thing that has been happening over the years. So, coming back to your question, it’s very, very difficult to get into those spaces.

DF: Teko, thanks a lot for your time. You are a star.

TM: Pleasure, my brother.