So Many Questions

THE DA’s coalition government in the Nelson Mandela Bay metro has been in turmoil for six months. Chris Barron asked DA leader Mmusi Maimane . . .

If you can’t make coalition government work in Nelson Mandela Bay, how will you do it nationally in 2019? The problem there is not the coalition, it’s [deputy mayor Mongameli] Bobani. Not just him. United Democratic Movement leader Bantu Holomisa has attacked the DA for its handling of the coalition. If you have to take a strong stance against one of your coalition partners for the benefit of the people, then you have to. It doesn’t bode well for 2019, does it? It’s part of the learning curve. The fact is that coalition politics is the future and we can’t give up on that project. How much more difficult will it be with the EFF given your fundamental ideological differences? What’s become a guiding principle is not ideology but a government programme of delivery. Our critical focus is how do we deliver, how do we build a capable state. There are points of agreement around that. How wide is the gap between you? Not as extreme as what is put out. Coalition doesn’t mean you have to agree on everything. Do you have a personal rapport with Malema? Yes. I respect him as the leader of another opposition party, and we work together on things we agree on. Is there a danger of being seduced by his charm? I have a party to lead and a job to do, and our party is bigger than his. So we’ve got to focus on being able to deliver. One of you is going to have to give way on fundamental issues in 2019. Which one will it be? The bigger you are the more influence you have on these issues. They need to be dealt with and we must find points of consensus. Do you have the same ethics? I can’t speak about his ethics . . . They’re fairly well known . . . Didn’t he say Zuma’s alleged rape victim enjoyed it? I don’t share his ethics about rape, or his views on race or genocide or killing of white people. So how can you do business with him? I’m not doing business with him. I’m simply saying, where we agree . . . In 2019 you’ll have to do business with him if you want to form a coalition government, won’t you? On the basis of what delivers for South Africa. This is about saying: “Here’s a government programme, do you agree that we need to do these things?” If he doesn’t agree, then there’s no gun to my head that says we must. We can sit back and say: “We don’t agree and so it’s not in our interests to go into government.” We’re not desperate to go into government at the expense of principle or with leadership that will not advance the South African project. Do you trust him? I don’t have to trust him. I trust our agreement. Can you trust an agreement with someone who said he’d kill for Zuma and now calls for his blood? If he ultimately believes he must do a coalition with the ANC that is something they must negotiate. Do you see the DA forming a coalition with a breakaway ANC formation? If there are people in the ANC who still stand for the constitution and nonracialism and building a capable state, we will work with them.

Coming after their December congress there is potential for them to split, and we’ll deal with whatever formation wants to fight for those values. Are you planning for that possibility? There are multiple scenarios that can emerge. We have to plan for all of them. Of course one scenario is a split in the ANC. Are you in talks with people in the ANC about 2019?

There’s always a conversation about South Africa, but I can’t come out publicly and pronounce who those people are. Why have you taken so long to put the Helen Zille issue behind you? Because she’s requested legal representation and that process is under way. I have to make sure it is done properly. You’re the leader, haven’t you lost an opportunity to demonstrate it? I’ve charged her. It is frustrating to me but I must operate within the institutional framework. Aren’t you hiding behind it? Far from. I’m frustrated with these institutions. That it has taken so long. How divisive has it been? I think it’s been a very important issue for the DA . . . How divisive has it been? It’s been damaging. Would you have done the party, and your own image, a lot of good if you’d exercised your powers as a leader immediately and fired her? If those powers had been available to me as the leader I would have exercised them. Will you give evidence on behalf of KwaZulu-Natal MPL Mbali Ntuli when her case — for allegedly liking a Facebook comment calling Zille a racist — is heard? I’ll give evidence on behalf of the DA. It’s not my job to pick sides. How divisive is race in the DA? Not at all. Remember, this was a charge laid by a black person against another black person.