CITY PROGRESSING NICELY UNDER THE GUIDANCE OF JOHNSON AND ASHTON
EXCLUSIVE
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Each season we’ve been here, it’s been about progression because my model, that I’ve used in slightly different ways but it’s a similar core at every club, is based on progression
LEE Johnson often speaks of connections on the field and how two players complementing each other’s talents forms the basis for his selections; whether that be Famara Diedhiou and Niclas Eliasson or Josh Brownhill and Adam Nagy.
But, ultimately, players come and go and perhaps the most important connection at Bristol City, at least since February 2016 has been that between boardroom and management: specifically Mark Ashton and Lee Johnson.
Both arrived at Ashton Gate within the space of 21 days, just under four years ago, having not met prior to BS3, and their partnership has been integral to the Robins’ rise up the Championship and establishment as a genuine Premier League promotion contender.
In many ways it’s taken for granted how well they get on, and how strong the professional bond is, but it helps set the example and creates an environment for the rest of the organisation to emulate.
As well as a sharing of values, worth ethic and desire to get City into the Premier League, Johnson was in London last Thursday to see Ashton named Championship CEO of the Year - an appointment, amid a hectic fixture schedule, he probably didn’t need to make illustrating their closeness.
Ashton has become a sounding board, away from the intensity of Failand, to share ideas, thoughts, plans and even anxieties and the head coach admits they probably speak at least two to three times a day. But as Ashton explains in a detailed conversation with the Bristol Post, the relationship between coaching staff and the business side of the club is the envy of teams across the EFL and beyond.
This interview surrounds the strength of that partnership and why it’s important, plus the club’s position on and off the field, the volume of changes that have occured since last season including why Marlon Pack was sold and why the Lansdowns are such unique owners.
HOW WOULD YOU GRADE THE SEASON SO FAR OUT OF TEN, NOT JUST PERFORMANCES BUT THE CLUB AND HOW EVERYTHING IS FUNCTIONING? LOOK, people ask me what our plans are, and our aspirations are, so let me start there.
It’s quite dull and boring when I talk about progression but look at all the clubs I’ve been to in the past, they’ve all got promoted, every single one, that is my expertise.
We develop clubs and take it from good to bad, but to do that you’ve got to develop it on and off the pitch, you can’t do it in isolation.
Each season we’ve been here, it’s been about progression because my model, that I’ve used in slightly different ways but it’s a similar core at every club, is based on progression, because if we keep progressing the way we are, ultimately we’ll be promoted, but I can’t tell you when.
The reason I can’t tell you when is because this industry is not like any other business. I can’t tell whether we’re going to get three bad injuries, whether it’s the width of a post that we don’t score, that we don’t get a bad refereeing decision or we drop out of form etc. But the theory is always progression and that’s off the pitch and on the pitch.
So, if were talking about this season specifically, we’ve had two seasons of progression before this one and we have a model which is really interesting because I think a lot of clubs are looking at what we’re doing saying, ‘you’ve just released your accounts and you’ve got better, how are you doing that?’
The start of this season, to be honest, began before the last season had finished. We’d had a good season and we were there or thereabouts, but the bit that probably hit me last season was when we lost to Derby at home. It was a pivotal point for me personally, at that point I went ‘right I’m not waiting, how can we get better?’
And whether its right or wrong, I literally haven’t had a day off since that day, and that’s fine because it’s my choice and that’s what I want to do. I’m driven to getting us better from that point.
We went into the summer and Lee and I sat down, and had an initial conversation with Steve (Lansdown) about what are objectives are for the season and what the finances are like and from that Lee and I constructed a plan on and off the pitch. That initially led to some staff changes off the pitch and Lee works in training on those changes for on the pitch, but everything we do is geared towards making us better.
I think we have got better and I
think a testament to everyone at the club is that we had a summer of circa 13 ins and nine outs among a raft of new contracts, and I knew we’d be slow out the blocks due to late departures as you saw with Leeds, but we were doing well, then we hit injuries that no one could have forecasted.
The underbelly that we recruited, though, have stepped in and done exactly what we recruited them to do, whether that’s Tommy Rowe, Taylor Moore, Pedro Perreria or Han-Noah Massengo; they’ve all come in and delivered because were right in contention, and now we have more experienced and bigger signings coming back and having to fight for their place in the team.
Lee and his team have to take credit for making sure that not only was that first 11 ready but that the whole squad was also ready.
You’re asking me to put a number on it though, bloody hell, I don’t know but I do think we’re better and I think we’ve improved. HAS THERE BEEN A SPECIFIC IMPROVEMENT? YOU TALK ABOUT THE SQUAD AND THE FACT SQUAD PLAYERS HAVE STEPPED UP THIS SEASON STARTING with off the pitch first. Where we are good here is that we’re not afraid to learn and absorb knowledge and information so every time we go through a difficult period we don’t just brush it under the carpet, we look and say what could we have done differently to effect that. So, we’ve taken another season’s worth of knowledge, which was ultimately frustration because we wanted to get into those play-offs and we didn’t, and think how do we improve again?
Off the pitch we have made some staff changes, those were really good people who did a really good job for this club in the period they were here but it’s time to evolve. If you don’t evolve and don’t move forward in this industry quickly you will go backwards, you will 100 per cent go backwards.
I think we’ve got stronger mentally as a unit off the pitch and we’ve got more detailed in our planning. The planning that you’ll see in Lee’s office and here, we’ve got these screens up which I’ve had to turn off for this interview because it’s got names on it, but the screens are mirrored. Left hand knows what the right hand is doing, right hand knows what the left is doing, and trust me that organisation is huge. We’re now becoming an even bigger football club and part of an even bigger group.
On the pitch I think you’ve got a further emergence of some of the talent we recruited three years ago, Brownhill, O’Dowda Taylor Moore, Eliasson etc, all of a sudden have stepped up.
It’s difficult, really difficult, I have to give it to Lee he’s very brave, one of the most difficult decisions we had over the summer was do we or don’t we sell Marlon Pack?
The easy thing to do would have been to keep Marlon because there was no pressure from Steve and Maggie to sell anyone, but as a manager who wants to move us forward part of the thought process with Marlon was that he’s been a really good servant to this football club but if he’s not here, then HanNoah plays and that is what has happened, that is part of the thought process and it keeps us moving forward. At that point it was about getting the best value which we did.
IN TERMS OF MARLON, DID THE TIME RESTRICTION IN TERMS OF COMING TO THE END OF THE WINDOW FORCE THE
DECISION WITH HIM?
NO, not really. We have good knowledge of what’s coming down the line, so we had those discussions not hugely earlier, but a little bit earlier so we knew what was to come. Lee is one of the bravest young managers I’ve worked with in his decision-making and it’s all about doing what’s right for the football club. Han-Noah has played a lot more this season than he probably would have if Marlon was still here and I think Browny has kicked on again. Callum has finally signed his contract and he’s settled and all of a sudden he’s kicking on again, Taylor has come back and you can see he’s now benefited from his experience out on loan.
You look at Antoine (Semenyo) and you need to remember that only 18 months ago he hadn’t kicked a ball in professional football, he’s going to be really big for us now and in the future.
So I think that is an improvement for us. Again, you speak to anyone around this football club or anyone who’s been at this football club in the last three/four years and they’ll tell you Lee is outstanding on the grass. His ability to recognise and develop players where they need to be at a fast rate and play them, when others possibly wouldn’t, is key to our model, that’s where, as Steve says, we have to stick to our knitting, don’t be afraid to put HanNoah in, don’t be afraid to put Taylor Moore in, don’t be afraid to put Brownhill in, it’s what we do.
Lee and his staff are great at that and they don’t change from that. IT SEEMS YOUR RELATIONSHIP WITH LEE HAS GROWN - IS THAT SOMETHING YOU’VE NOTICED IN HOW YOU OPERATE TOGETHER?
YEAH, I think its natural when you spend that much time with someone that you grow closer, we have a relationship that is based on mutual respect and trust, it doesn’t mean we agree all the time and we have robust discussions but we know where the lines are and there’s a belief from both of us that we know the end goal and we’re trying to find ways to get to it.
I think the same with Lee’s staff and my staff - everyone’s really tight. One of the things that continually proves that is our communication and the effectiveness of our communication.
Part of what I do is spend a lot of time with other Premier League and Championship clubs at ownership and CEO levels and the consistent conversation is how do you and Lee seem to communicate so well. One of our strengths, our biggest strength here, is our ownership because we have solid logical Bristolian ownership trying to do the right thing. Whether you speak to Steve or Maggie Lansdown you get the same message, or whether you speak to Jon Lansdown, you cannot get water between any of us. Without that we can’t do what we do and I’m really grateful for that platform to work from because without it I can’t do what I do and Lee can’t do what he does.
DID YOU KNOW LEE BEFORE YOU WORKED TOGETHER? NO, I had never met him. My first impressions were that he’s got good banter. I’ll tell you what happened when I interviewed him, and I’d never met him before. I came out of that interview and called Luke (Werhun), I said we’ve got a problem, were not going to find any better than this. He responded what do you mean? I said well look, when I appointed Aidy Boothroyd at Watford I had the same feeling, and when I appointed Brendan Rogers to his first managerial job I had the same feeling, and I’ve got exactly the same feeling again but I need to meet him again and do a bit more digging.
We had what I call a meeting of minds but I called Steve and asked him what he thought. Steve knew him as a player and knew him better than I did so I needed to sensecheck, but Steve said I was right in what I said and I think from that moment all my experience and what I wanted for this football club resonated in Lee; extremely hard working, too hard working at times, bright and forward thinking, and honest.
The one thing I’ve found working with Lee is honesty, though. We’re honest and if we don’t agree we will tell each other and have that discussion but I’ve never once not felt that there was a solid honesty about him and you get the same honesty from the Lansdown family and that’s why it works so well.
In an industry that is fragmented at times, you don’t get that here and that is what has allowed me to do my job.
SO, WHEN YOU FIRST MET IT WAS JUST, AS YOU SAY, A
MEETING OF MINDS? YEAH, we both have very high work ethic and we both have an obsession, that’s the only way I can describe it, it seems that our starts get earlier and our finishes get later, for both of us this is not a job it’s a way of life and that’s fine because it’s what we choose to do.
I’ll probably look 65 in my 40s but that’s how it has to be and I really believe we’re building a very special football club, I really do.
We’ve got a lot of special people in this club who are really passionate about it and when you pull all of that together in the right areas, you’ve got to succeed, you’ve got to.
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Lee is one of the bravest young managers I’ve worked with in his decision-making and it’s all about doing what’s right for the football club