NCUTI GATWA
IN CONVERSATION WITH CONNOR SWINDELLS
If a pair of 16-year-olds running a covert sex therapy clinic in their American-styled high school set in the British countryside sounded like a risk to Netflix, it was one that paid off handsomely in the form of Sex Education. The teen comedy-drama was an instant hit globally when it debuted in January 2019, coaxing Netflix to do something the company very rarely does: release the streaming figures. When the show was standing at a cool 40 million within a matter of weeks, it’s no wonder the platform wanted to shout about its unprecedented success.
Straddling between slapstick, barmy comedy scenarios and genuine, sincere drama, Sex Education is brimming with humour and heart. At its core is Eric Effoing, an openly gay black student with a smile that brightens up even the rainiest of British days. His journey throughout the series resonated with LGBTQ audiences the world over, subverting tired tropes of what a gay or a black character would traditionally be portrayed as.
This was a fresh take on a teen drama that poked fun at the stereotypes that plagued the genre before – and Eric was a shining example of authentic, honest and boundary-pushing storytelling. His warmth and immediate popularity is driven by the actor who plays him: Ncuti Gatwa. “I thought that people might be confused by it,” he laughs when interviewed by his co-star Connor Swindells for his GAY TIMES cover story. “When I got the script, I thought it was either the funniest thing I’d ever read in my life, or the weirdest shit I’d ever read. I couldn’t figure it out, it was either/or.”
Connor plays Adam Groff in the show; a character who is grappling with his own identity and in the process becomes entangled with Eric. “He was obsessed with Eric,” Ncuti says. “Turn around and Adam’s just there, turn around and he’s staring at you with a sausage in his mouth – the clues were there. So, I knew.” As we head into Sex Education season two – which will be available to watch from 17 January – the dynamic between Eric and Adam is “complicated”. We don’t want to give too much away, but as Ncuti puts it himself: “There will be opinions!”
Here, Connor speaks with Ncuti about the impact of the show around the world, the importance of representation in mainstream media, how Sex Education is breaking down the taboo of speaking openly and honestly about sex, and teases what we can expect as we head into the highly-anticipated second season.
Connor:
How has life changed since the first season of Sex Education was released on Netflix?
Ncuti:
Life has changed quite considerably. It was such a huge hit and it’s launched us all into the public eye in such an immediate way. It’s cool to be in the thing everyone seems to love.
Connor:
What was your first reaction to the show being big? Were you happy?
Ncuti:
Oh, gassed, fucking gassed. I thought ‘Fuck you haters, fuck off my haters!’ Yeah I was gassed, and it seemed to keep getting bi¡er. When it dropped, there was a little bit of a reaction. And then each week went by it seemed to be more people watching and more people watching. Then it was the number one IMDB thing for a bit - it was mad. Do you remember that? Then Netflix flippin’ releasing the numbers and I was like ‘What?’ And to be in a show, where it’s the first time that Netflix did it. So it felt amazing. I didn’t think I was going to get Sex Ed, and just before I did, life was a bit peak. So getting it, and being a part of something so successful it felt like the bi¡est blessing of time.
Connor:
Although it’s a British teen drama, it had such a wide international appeal instantly - did you expect that?
Ncuti:
No, I didn’t expect that. I didn’t expect it at all because it was just so different. Even shooting it, we knew that it looked different, it had a different aesthetic, and just a different format. And obviously we’re tackling issues that aren’t commonly tackled in teen dramas.
Connor:
It makes sense now!
Ncuti:
But when we were making it, we had nothing to go by. I knew people were going to watch it because we had Gillian Anderson and she has such a core base. But I didn’t think it was going to have the impact that it had. I thought that people might be confused by it. When I got the script, I thought it was either the funniest thing I’d ever read in my life, or the weirdest shit I’d ever read. I couldn’t figure it out, it was either/or. You don’t know what people are going to like.
Connor:
You could never imagine the kind of success that we’ve had.
Ncuti:
Yeah, you can’t.
Connor:
That happens to other people.
Ncuti:
Yeah! For us, we had never been involved in something like that, ever. And also coming from working-class backgrounds as well, I never expected something that I’m in, that we’re in, to blow up like that. But it did.
Connor:
Why do you think the show connected with audiences so quickly?
Ncuti:
I think because it has a lot of heart to it and a lot of truth to it. And like I said, it’s tackling issues that don’t commonly get tackled, and we’re starting conversations about things that get made taboo for no reason. And I feel like it’s very funny, but it’s also quite tragic as well. Each character has some form of pain, you know what I mean? But then the show’s quite funny, and I feel that makes it very real and honest. And I think that’s what people connected with, the realness of the show.
Connor:
It’s kind of absurd at times, but then also very sincere. I haven’t really seen anything like that before, which treads the line between absurdity and sincerity in such a way that I find really interesting. And with a subject matter that everyone is faced with as human beings. It’s not like it’s a niche topic that the show is about, it’s about sex, and growing up, which everyone goes through.
Ncuti:
Exactly, it’s something that everyone can relate to. And these issues, many people have had them. And why else did it impact people? The writing was really good and fresh, and I think people were ready for that, and I think the world was ready to hear new stories told from fresh perspectives, and that’s what we did.
Connor:
Diverse stories.
Ncuti:
Diverse stories, innit.
Connor:
In episode 7 of season 1, Eric has that memorable, emotional scene with his father which resonated with a lot of people in the LGBTQ community. Why do you think it was so important?
Ncuti:
Just because we need to see all types of love on our screen represented. And I think it was a really beautiful representation of a young LGBT boy of colour and his journey through life, and his journey through his own acceptance, his culture, coming from a West African background. I was at UK Black Pride and the amount of people who were coming up to me specifically about the relationship between Eric and his dad was constant. And I think it really touched people to see this portrayal of this black man, this strong big black man loving his gay son. It was quite beautiful, and it’s something that we don’t see often and I think that’s why it impacted people. It was an interesting portrayal of masculinity as well. I think it’s important to show that level of acceptance and love between men because there’s a lot of young boys out there killing themselves and killing each other because of their views on masculinity or their identity. So it was a nice portrayal of
masculinity.
Connor:
A lot of my family, their favourite character is Eric because he represents oppression, or someone who is very oppressed. And from a working-class, white, Romani, traveller family their favourite character from a TV show is a gay, black young man.
Ncuti:
That is mental!
Connor:
But it makes sense, as now their views have changed as well. Their culture is in a world that they’re having to adapt to, and they’re seeing their own oppression through your portrayal [of Eric].
Ncuti:
How fascinating! I was thinking about this the other day, do you know how I used to train in that bodybuilder’s gym in Tottenham? Full of ex-cons and that, and they would come up to me, and be like ‘You’re that brother from Sex Education, you’re my favourite character, you’re my girlfriend’s favourite character, can I get a picture?’ And I found it so funny that these big, hench guys at my gym, and their favourite character is Eric. That’s the power of the show, innit. It’s changing people’s perspectives just through representation. This is why representation matters.
Connor:
What was the reaction like for you after people saw that episode?
Ncuti:
Yeah, it was great. I definitely felt a sense of responsibility being Eric, because I know how much he means to people, and people around the world. I get messages from people in different countries where homosexuality is illegal, so being able to play a character who gives people strength and hope is very important. And being part of a show where lots of different characters can do that, as I feel like people can find strength with your character, in his journey with his dad, and how he’s struling with the lack of intimacy and affection. Being part of a show that’s empowering feels cool.
Connor:
When Eric meets the older gay black man in season 1 that he identifies with, he gains the confidence and self-acceptance to be his authentic self. How does it feel that Eric is that role model to plenty of young queer people of colour at home who traditionally have rarely seen themselves represented in this way?
Ncuti:
It feels wonderful. I’m an uncle, and I like to take care of my people. But it feels important.
Connor:
I love that scene in series 1, episode 7 with the man Eric meets at the roadside. That’s one of my favourite bits.
Ncuti:
It was a beautiful moment for Eric, who for the first time, met someone that he could identify with.
Connor:
Did you have people like that growing up?
Ncuti:
Not really, only my mum and dad. I think the first time I saw myself represented in the media was when Top Boy first started. I was at drama school, training classically, and in TV and film I couldn’t really see any people of colour. So I thought, ‘Who’s going to have me?’ So, 2011 was the first time I saw myself represented. But now we’re in a moment in time where we’re telling these stories, and people are feeling represented. It feels very important to me, and I want to continue playing characters that matter and represent people.
Connor:
And it gives people something to strive for. If you don’t have role models, you don’t know where to go. It gives people a cause.
Ncuti:
Yeah, I’m happy to do that, call me Uncle Ncuti!
Connor:
When people are criticising the lack of inclusivity in sex and relationships education within schools, does that make a show like this even more vital to start conversations?
Ncuti:
Yes, because there should be more inclusion in sex education in schools! I’d just like to say that Scotland has introduced an LGBTQIA+ curriculum into our sex education.
Connor:
Really?
Ncuti:
Yes, we have! Scotland is always on the ball. But sex education should be more inclusive because not everyone is having sex to have a baby. And that’s the main angle of sex education in schools now, reproductivity. We need to have more chats about relationships, mental health within sexual health, it just needs to be a lot broader and a lot better.
Connor:
Would you say that Sex Education is breaking down the taboo of people talking about sex in a positive and informative way?
Ncuti:
Yeah.
Connor:
I’ve had a lot of conversations with family about sex now that I wouldn’t have had before.
Ncuti:
Yeah, I’d say that. And people who I would never imagine talking about sex so openly as a direct follow-up from a conversation about the show.
Connor:
And it will always start off funny, they’ll talk about a funny moment from the show, and it’ll lead into a broader, deeper conversation about the show about a particular issue.
Ncuti:
It’s cool though. We’re all here because of sex. Why is it being made so secretive and taboo? When I think about queer sexuality and female sexuality, there’s a lot of shame attached to those two things. And the fact that Sex Education showcases those two things in such an open but normal way is very powerful.
Connor:
What was the most difficult scene to film and why?
Ncuti:
Eric getting jumped, because it was cold! I was in batty riders, I was walking down a steep steep hill in six-inch platforms - very well thank you very much! - and that was difficult because I had to keep doing it again and again. Technically it was difficult, it was cold. And obviously, he’s in quite a dark place emotionally, and trying to stay in that place when it’s cold and all that kind of stuff is difficult. I’ve been jumped before, and so there was personal experience there. But that’s what we do as actors, there’s always a little bit of us that we bring into roles, and we somehow enjoy it. That was a difficult scene to shoot, but definitely fulfilling.
Connor:
And you were able to take your past trauma and share it, not waste it, because otherwise it’s just trauma. When you first read the script for Eric and Adam’s kiss in season 1, did that moment surprise you?
Ncuti:
No, I knew from the moment that Adam pushed Eric into the locker. When we were shooting episode 1, I was like ‘We’re going to end up together.’ And lo and behold, when I was flipping through that episode I was like ‘Aha, I knew.’ He was obsessed with Eric. Turn around and Adam’s just there, turn
around and he’s staring at you with a sausage in his mouth, the clues were there. So, I knew.
Connor:
How would you describe the dynamic between Eric and Adam in the second season?
Ncuti:
More complicated. Heartbreaking, a bit.
Connor:
Full of heart.
Ncuti:
But full of heart, yeah.
Connor:
But more complicated, more questions, more opinions, there’ll definitely be more opinions.
Ncuti:
There’ll be opinions, bro. There’s going to be opinions! I would describe it as heartbreaking because Adam is so human. What you’ve done with him is very clever, he’s so human and there’s so much pain in Adam’s eyes as well. And he has that relationship with his dad, and how that’s affected him.
Connor:
And Eric knows that.
Ncuti:
And Eric knows that, he’s the first person to ever see all this. When he sees Adam at prom, and when he calls Adam out in the music classroom. They’re both boys that have been clocking each other and also both clocking that they’re both searching for intimacy and love. Everyone can identify with his want to be loved. It’s not as easy as it seems, the whole Eric and Adam thing, of where Adam is the bad guy. Season 2 is complicated because we delve a lot deeper into all of the characters’ storylines, so we learn a lot more about Adam, we learn a lot more about Eric. And we’ll see where that goes.
Connor:
How would you say the second season differs from the first?
Ncuti:
It’s more in-depth, more intense. The world is just opened up, more... what’s the word?
Connor:
Inclusion. Bier. It’s just deeper, but it’s different because the first season was about laying foundations, and the second season is about building upon them.
Ncuti:
Exactly. In season 1, there’s a lot you have to set up, characters you have to introduce, and we only have eight episodes. There’s only so much you can do within that time. But exactly like you said, we’ve set that up now, so we can just be like ‘We’re in that world now.’ We’re just going, the universe is spinning. Season 2 is explosive.
Connor:
What are your hopes for the characters of Eric and Adam in the future? Not as them as one, but individually.
Ncuti:
Just that they can both be happy, and continue to find love and acceptance within themselves.
Connor:
That’s true for all the characters, that’s the main theme finding love and acceptance for yourself.
Ncuti:
All of them! They’re all searching for it. But that’s what the show does it so well, the relationships. I’m hoping that they find more love and acceptance in themselves.
Connor:
Teen dramas always have a dear place in people’s hearts. What would you like the legacy for Sex Education to be for future viewers?
Ncuti:
Acceptance and empowerment. I hope it’s a show that’s empowered people, all people. And a show that’s encouraged people to be open and be honest and take up space and love themselves and accept wherever they are in their journey. I hope it’s a show that makes people face their fronts. Don’t look right, and don’t look left, because you’ll get lost, just face your front and follow your own path. I hope that’s the legacy it leaves, what about you?
Connor:
I agree completely. I hope that the legacy is that it was the start of all that.
I HOPE IT’S A SHOW THAT’S EMPOWERED PEOPLE, ALL PEOPLE. AND A SHOW THAT’S ENCOURAGED PEOPLE TO BE OPEN AND BE HONEST AND TAKE UP SPACE AND LOVE THEMSELVES AND ACCEPT WHEREVER THEY ARE IN
THEIR JOURNEY.