‘Ulez was Boris Johnson’s policy – I stole it from him’

The Mayor of London talks to Interviewer of the Year Mick Brown about his divisive clean air plan, why Cressida Dick had to go and his struggles with insomnia

It is 12.7 miles from Sadiq Khan’s home in Earlsfield, south-west London to the new City Hall in Docklands. Before meeting Khan, I’d imagined him traversing London in his mayoral car, meditating on the city’s many splendours while navigating London’s clogged traffic before finally arriving at his office.

In fact, none of that is true. Unless instructed by the police to be driven in an unmarked official vehicle, Khan travels to the office by tube and the Docklands Light Railway.

People tend to ignore him, or politely pretend to. “It’s that very British thing, people just get on with reading their newspaper or their phone. Sometimes someone will ask for a selfie or there’s a thumbs up, or ‘keep it going’.”

Somewhat surprisingly, no-one has had anything to say about the ultra low emission zone (Ulez) – the Labour Mayor of London’s proposal to extend the clean air charge to the boundaries of Greater London, and one of the city’s most divisive topics. “No, I can’t think of an occasion when that’s happened.”

London’s first Muslim mayor, Khan has been in office since 2016. In that time, he has worked with five Conservative prime ministers and faced multiple challenges – including battles with TFL about funding, the murder of Sarah Everard, concerns over knife crime and the sacking of Cressida Dick as the Metropolitan Police commissioner. But as he seeks a historic third term as mayor in May next year, it could be Ulez that stands in his way.

The issue has become increasingly heated. At a public meeting last week in Ealing town hall, Khan was greeted by protestors, including some depicting him with a swastika and a hammer and sickle, and citing conspiracy theories about “15-minute cities” being a way to control the population. “Some of those outside are part of the far-right,” he said at the meeting. “Some are Covid deniers. Some are vaccine-deniers. And some are Tories.” His comments sparked anger in the crowd, with members of the public reportedly shouting back: “We are not far-right – normal people are not far-right.”

He sighs. “My point was that there were decent people, including Tory members, who’ve got legitimate objections, and I’m not sure these decent people realised that standing with them were conspiracy theorists and people holding swastikas.”

Khan’s office in the new City Hall – the greenest city hall in the world, he says – opened a year ago and overlooks the old Victoria dock, new developments lining the banks. “I call it Tenerife on the Thames,” he says. “Come back in August, there’s open water swimming in the summer.”

The old city hall at Tower Bridge was “gorgeous”, he says. But the Greater London Authority were paying £12million in rent. “We own this building, so we can save £6 million within five years.”

And he’s off… Khan, a former lawyer, talks quickly and with an impressive recall of statistics, figures and numbers, fired at a machine-gun pace. His tone is relentlessly upbeat, positive and quick to cite his achievements – but also to acknowledge his mistakes, careful to avoid the appearance of arrogance. “In all humility” is a recurring phrase.

If his predecessor Boris Johnson invariably looked shambolic – wildhaired and baggy-suited – Khan, who is 52, always polishes up nicely. His hair is neatly trimmed, his suit sharp. “I think it’s important to look smart when you’re the mayor. You should respect the job.” But he only wears a tie, he says, “when I’m meeting the King, it’s a formal occasion or something bad’s happened”.

How many times does he have to meet the King? Quite often, as it happens. He was with him last week at a foodbank, and three weeks ago, visiting a pop-up support centre for Syrians affected by the recent earthquake in that country. Khan readily describes himself as a workaholic, “but the King is amazing, he really is”.

Khan’s father Amanullah and mother Sehrun arrived in London from Pakistan in 1968. Khan was the fifth of eight children, seven of whom were boys, who grew up in a three-bedroom council flat. Amanullah worked as a bus driver and Sehrun as a seamstress. “The way I describe myself, I’m a working-class boy and a middle-class man. And you don’t forget your working-class roots.”

After working as a lawyer specialising in human rights, he became London’s first Muslim MP when he was elected for his local constituency of Tooting in 2005, before going on to serve in the cabinet under Gordon Brown as minister of state for transport and under secretary of state for communities and local government.

More affable in person than he can sometimes appear in media interviews, where he often seems brittle and on the defensive, he is a man – to put it politely – who tends to divide opinion. When I asked my taxi driver what he thought of the mayor, he replied, “I’d rather not tell you.” But he did anyway, at some length – and in any conversation, the same subjects come up time and again. Crime, and most recently, and controversially, Ulez.

The Ulez currently covers the area inside the North and South Circular Roads, but Khan intends to expand the zone to cover all of Greater London – effectively taking it up to most roads inside the M25 motorway. Under the scheme, planned to be introduced in August, drivers of non-compliant vehicles (e.g. a pre-2016 diesel car or pre-2006 petrol car) within the extended zone must pay a daily charge of £12.50. This includes residents of the Ulez.

The plan has come up against opposition from councils in outer London and the home counties, who mainly argue that the zone’s expansion will do little to improve air quality – and that it is being introduced at the worst possible time, because of the cost of living crisis.

An independent poll commissioned earlier this year suggested that 60 per cent of Londoners oppose the scheme. But Khan disputes its findings. “It was a loaded poll and it’s been dismissed by a lot of polling experts. The poll that’s been done with a straight question shows that twice as many Londoners support the scheme as are opposed to it – 51 per cent are in favour of expansion, 27 per cent are against it.”

London has historically faced major public health challenges, and “brave politicians in the past have not ducked in taking them on”, he says. The Great Stink of 1858, when hot weather exacerbated the stench of raw sewage dumped in the Thames, led to the introduction of a functioning sewage system. The choking smog of the 1950s led to “a really brave Conservative government”, moving power stations from the centre of the city in the face of fierce trade union opposition, protesting about loss of jobs.

“And, by the way, this isn’t my policy. I’ve stolen Boris Johnson’s,” he says. “In 2013, Johnson announced he would be doing a Ulez. But he did that classic thing that politicians do; he announced something that he left for other politicians to do. I’m going to see it through.”

Since its introduction in 2019, the Ulez has reduced harmful pollution levels in central London by almost half. Over the past 12 months alone, Ulez has reduced nitrogen dioxide levels in central London by 46 per cent. Five million more Londoners will breathe cleaner air if the Ulez expands to cover the whole city.

According to a study by Imperial College, every year 4,000 people die prematurely because of poor air quality. “It’s an invisible killer. And when you look at those 4,000 deaths, the largest number are in outer London, where you have a greater number of old people for whom bad air quality makes them more susceptible to heart disease and other factors. In London, 500,000 people suffer from asthma and respiratory issues.”

The scheme, he goes on, will save the NHS £10.5billion, because it will not be treating people with asthma and respiratory issues. “The CBI says it will save businesses £1.6billion a year because staff won’t be off sick with respiratory issues.”

Talking of money, analysis by The Daily Telegraph suggests Ulez is on track to be a penalty bonanza for the mayor. Fines for failing to pay the charge will increase from £160 to £180, and those collected during the first 11 months of 2022 totalled £56,995,835. The scheme is not allowed to be “revenue generating” and Khan has pledged to plough all the money made from the new charge into better public transport and active travel. Ulez, he insists, is not about raising revenue: “It’s about reducing the number of non-compliant vehicles, which means you pay zero, and to make the air quality better.”

Looking to the future, as more cars go electric, he says he wants to see an electric charging point “on every street in London”. There are 11,000 electric charging points in the capital – a third of the UK total. What about those who can’t afford to replace their car, let alone with an electric one? Khan has a plan, and says he has found £110million to support people make the transition “without a penny of support from the Government”.

We talk about the other big issue on his desk – crime. Contrary to popular perception, crime rates in London have actually gone down in recent years. Compared with the 12 months pre-pandemic burglary is down by 33 per cent; homicide by 27 per cent; knife-enabled crime by 19 per cent; gun crime by 30 per cent and robbery by 30 per cent.

But “that’s not good enough”, Khan says. And it remains a fact that many Londoners, particularly women, do not feel safe. “I can’t wish that away. I’ve got to take action.”

He pauses. “One of the things I have the humility to accept is that a woman’s experience of being in London is different to mine. I’ve got no experience of being touched up on the tube or bus. Nobody’s ever looked at me in a lecherous way. I can use the tube and not worry about people treating me inappropriately. That’s not the experience of women and girls.”

We talk about the departure of Cressida Dick as commissioner. She resigned in controversial circumstances in February last year. Khan talks of “a loss of confidence” in Dick’s understanding of “cultural issues” affecting crime, and her inability to deal with them. “The short answer is we had a series of incidents, some of them high profile, where it didn’t appear to me the former commissioner really understood the reasons why they were happening.”

He cites the cases of the four men in the gay community murdered by the serial killer Stephen Port, and the 15-year-old named only as “Child Q” who was stopped and strip-searched by police without another adult present after she was wrongly accused of possessing cannabis. And there was the horrific abduction and murder of Everard. “I told the commissioner what needed to happen was a comprehensive plan to address what I thought were systemic cultural issues in the police service, and secondly a comprehensive plan to win back the trust and confidence of Londoners.

“And I was quite clear to Cressida Dick that because of her inability to address these issues she had lost my confidence.”

Khan prevailed in Dick’s departure in the face of Boris Johnson, Priti Patel and the policing minister Kit Malthouse, who wanted her to stay on. “It was a difficult few days,” he says now, “incredibly stressful. When you’re in the position I’ve got, you don’t do something to be popular. You’ve got to do it because you believe that it’s the right thing to do. If you can’t stand the heat you shouldn’t be the mayor.”

Has he spoken to Dick since? “No.” Does he expect to? “No.”

He enjoys much better relations with, and has more confidence in, Sir Mark Rowley, who took up the job as Met Commissioner in September.

‘‘We get on. We’re not besties; we don’t go to each other’s homes and stuff. But I’ve got a huge amount of respect for Sir Mark. My job is to support him but also to challenge him. Londoners don’t want their mayor to be unconditionally supportive.”

In a bid to restore public confidence, Rowley has pledged to change the culture in the Met, addressing complaints about the treatment of crime and purging the force of corrupt and violent officers in the wake of the murder of Everard and the conviction of the serial rapist David Carrick.

‘I’m a working-class boy and a middle-class man. You don’t forget your working-class roots’

‘I stay up at night until my daughters are home. I’ll probably still do that when they’re 45’

Yesterday, following a report by his office that one in three victims of crime in London was unsatisfied with the Met’s level of service, Khan announced a £3million annual fund to boost the number of staff responsible for caring for victims of crime. Crime, said Khan, “blights lives” and it was “imperative” that victims were “treated with the utmost compassion, sensitivity and respect. Successful prosecution of cases often rely on victim’s testimonies, so we need to do much more to inspire victims’ confidence”.

Rowley’s determination to cleanse the Augean stables of the Met is “a brave thing to do”, Khan says. “He understands he can’t be popular all the time. Sometimes it’s tough. Sir Mark is willing to be that. I don’t think the former commissioner was.”

Women, he says, were “appalled when days after Sarah Everard was abducted, the Met Police Service, approved by Cressida Dick, gave women the advice that if a police officer approaches you in those circumstances, just wave down a bus”, he rolls his eyes.

What advice would he give his two daughters, Anisah, 23, and Ammarah, 21, in the event of them being approached at night by a plain clothes policeman? “Ring up the police, 999 or 111 to check it is the police. There are bad people who impersonate police officers, and you’ve got to challenge what somebody tells you.”

Having finished university, both his daughters are working and back at home. “I’m a parent. I still stay up at night until they’re both home. I’ll probably still do that when they’re 45. It’s just one of those things.”

He and his wife, Saadiya, a lawyer and lecturer, were teenage sweethearts, attending neighbouring schools in Earlsfield – “I went to an all-boys school, Ernest Bevin, and she went to Graveney School, which was mixed. I remember, the head of her school, Mrs Stapleton, would patrol Welham Road stopping the Ernest Bevin boys getting to Graveney because of our reputation.” They have been married for 29 years.

“I’m really lucky with my family. There are no delusions in my home. In the morning I’ll fight with my daughters about using the bathroom.

“I may be at an event in the evening – and I say this not in an arrogant way – but the most important person in the room. And I’ll get home and it’s, ‘Don’t forget to put the bin out.’ And that’s a really important thing.”

As he looks ahead, Khan says he’s “excited about the prospect of working with a government led by Keir Starmer that is pro-london. This Government has been anti-london for a long time”.

That rather assumes Starmer will lead the next government. “There’s no complacency about that at all. Neither am I complacent about me winning. But I’m somebody who loves London. I’m the child of immigrants and this city has given me everything. And I’m seeking to give something back.”

He thinks about this. “I don’t sleep well. I’m a bit of an insomniac. Lying in bed at night, I look back on the day, what I got right, what I got wrong, what I can improve on, and I’ve never had, so far, a day that’s been perfect.”