The Definition of Obscenity
Questions remain as library board, public clash over explicit book
Answers remain elusive following a meeting of the Valley City Barnes County Public Library Board last week, which saw 17 community members come out in response to learning of a young adult non-fiction book which contains graphic illustrations of sex acts and instructions on how to masturbate, use sex toys and encourages consuming pornography.
The library board, minus member Deedra Froemke, largely defended the placement of the book, which is located on a shelf in the young adult section of the library, adjacent to comic books including Batman and Wonder Woman.
They said that additional copies had been ordered and should currently be at the library, so that community members can see and look at the book, Let’s Talk About It by Erica Moen and Matthew Nolan, on their own and make their own judgments on its suitability. The broad majority of those at the meeting, including the board and the community, had not had opportunity to see the book prior to the meeting.
“We do not censor”
Hilde van Gjessel, a health science professor at Valley City State University and president of the library board, opened up the public comment period, which occurred at the very end of the board meeting, making a statement in response to the story printed in last week’s Times-Record, which she claimed incorrectly described the location of the book.
“This is a book that is located in the youth-adult section, which in our library, that is about (ages) … 15 to 25,” van Gjessel said. “It is housed in the main floor … our children’s library is down here, so no, no children under 15, unless they are allowed to run around the building by their parents … would not come across this book.”
This statement was contradicted by Assistant Library Director Melissa Lloyd, who said later on that:
“We don’t restrict access to the library. If a child wishes to come upstairs and peruse the library, they have every freedom.”
Lloyd said that the library encourages kids to explore the library as they get older, and she said that anyone, regardless of age, could have checked out the book, Let’s Talk About It, so long as they had a library card.
Van Gijssel said that it was not the responsibility of the board to “micromanage” collection development, and that they follow a policy published on the library’s website.
“The policy is based on … best practices in libraries across the nation,” van Gijssel said. “This is a book that is highly recommended, it is a book for 11 to 18 year olds … because of course, it is called a teenage guide, so it answers questions. So it is there in the youth-adult section.”
Van Gijssel had posted on social media, in a comment on the TimesRecord’s page, that she wished she had had this book when she was a teenager.
“I have now seen the book and I would have liked this book,” Van Gijssel, who teaches health science at the college, said. “I want this stressed: I was talking in my personal title, not on behalf of the board. Right now I’m not answering that question in the sense that I’m not speaking on behalf of the board, but yes, I would have liked that book as a teenager because there is information in there that I would have liked to have back then.”
Some members of the board defended the library having this material freely available, as an aid against possible misinformation.
“I would like to go on the other side of this – any kid who is gutsy enough to walk up to the counter and check this out is having the conversation with friends at school and getting potentially inaccurate information, whereas if you check this book out, you’re getting the facts,” Annie Beauchman, who admitted she has not read the book, said. “It may be more facts than you’re comfortable with, but … at least this book gives the opportunity for kids to get factual information as opposed to going off what crazy stories middle school kids tell (or what they get on the internet).”
She dismissed the fact that the book urges its readers to seek out online communities dedicated to kinks and purchase pornography recommended their “fave” porn stars.
“If we go off what a book tells kids to look up on the internet, that parents are welcome to turn on their own personal parental controls on the internet,” Beauchman said, adding that she trusts the book’s contents are factual because: “Because when things go through a publisher, they have their own fact-based process that they go through before a legitimate publisher will publish things.”
Board member Allen Blume, who also claimed to have seen the book’s contents, argued it was not the role of the library to “censor” materials.
“We don’t censor – why should we?” Blume said. “I’ll answer it that way: I don’t control the kids’ curiosity. I don’t also control how people point someone towards knowledge. That’s between the author and the kid. If the parent needs to be there, then it’s the role for the parent.”
Following the meeting. Lloyd – who said she had seen the book’s contents – confirmed that it was former Library Director Steve Hammel who approved of the book’s placement in the young-adult section, on a shelf that sits next to a collection of comic books, including Batman and Wonder Woman.
Lloyd defended the book and insisted it fulfills a community need.
“It comes highly recommended from the publications that libraries follow in terms of information,” she said. “Whether you agree with that or not, that’s your decision. But as a librarian … that’s what we take into consideration. We take those reviews very seriously. This book, I believe, fulfills a need to the community.”
“Of course you censor”
Public comment was largely critical of the book’s location and placement on the shelf.
Phil Kleymann, a Valley City resident, opened things off, responding directly to Blume’s claim that the library does not censor.
“I’d first like to thank you. I have grandchildren and they use the library a lot … my grandkids are here a lot, and for you to say you don’t censor, that’s the dumbest thing I’ve ever heard in my life,” Kleymann said. “I can’t come up here and find a copy of Hustler magazine. I can’t find a section on adult videos. What’s this we don’t censor? Of course we censor. We have public decency, regular standards.”
He cited an incident where a man was charged for disorderly conduct, right here in Valley City, by shouting expletives in public via megaphone, following a complaint.
“Of course we censor, sir. We censor. For you to say that was very insulting to me, who send my children here – if my 11-year-old grandson came home and a neighbor gave him that book? I don’t know what I would have done with that,” Kleymann said. “You never answered (the Times-Record’s) questions. I came here expecting answers. I hear nothing, I hear a bunch of rhetoric. I hear a bunch of people running in circles. My grandchildren, I trust them to you. I trust you to use common decency.”
Barry Borg, a Barnes County resident, also spoke critically of the book’s explicit sexual content, which includes detailed images of multiple sexual positions and detailed instructions on masturbation.
“My question is, what would happen to this neighbor who gave this book to that 11-yearold?” Borg asked. “We have pornography laws. The guy who would give that book out on the street to an 11-yearold would probably be arrested for distributing pornography to a minor. If that happens out on the street, how come that’s okay here?”
Some board members had concerns about the book, most vocal being Dewey Magnuson, who had no issue with the book being in the library, but found its location to be questionable.
“I don’t speak on behalf of the board, I speak for myself,” Magnuson said. “I see things from a lot of perspectives right now … however, I do believe we protect our children from vaping, because we can’t promote flavors of vaping because that might make some sixyear-old to think bubblegum-flavored vaping is okay, so we take that out of gas stations, but yet we allow a book to be at eye-level. I’m not for burning books, for banning books, but I think a book should be in a place where the right appropriate age should check out if they choose.”
When told by Lloyd that there was no restriction on who could check out the book, Magnuson asked additional questions.
“If my nephew at 7-years old…was perusing around the library while I was looking for a book, there’s nothing to stop him … by the time he’s opened it,” He said. whether you’re okay with your child’s sexuality in doing that, that’s the parents decision. How many parents come to the library with their children at age 12? How many … when their parents come home from the library ask ‘what did you check out?’”
Senator Mike Wobbema also gave his public comment, dismissing the library’s defense that this work was no different than any other adult novel which could be left around a house for a child to find, a concern raised by others that night.
“The difference between that book and what you are talking about is that is a book of words that your parents have and this is a graphic book, the kids can open it up and just look at the pictures,” Wobbema said. “That’s going to draw a whole different level of attention then picking up mom’s book and trying to read it … you’re talking apples and oranges here and they’re not even relatable.”
Wobbema sparred with Blume, who said that nothing is achieved by trying to limit the access of children to sexual material.
“Knowledge in the world we are in has gotten out of the bottle a long, long time ago. There is no putting this genie back in,” Blume said. “The knowledge of human sexuality … are out there. We achieve nothing if we focus on little places where we might throw up roadblocks … no matter the age.”
Wobbema disagreed.
“I agree we can’t put the genie back in the bottle,” the senator said. “But neither do we need to feed the genie.”
Wobbema went on to suggest the library could invest its resources into less contentious material.
“I would just add one thing: you talked in the meeting today about limited resources. You have limited resources in everything you do,” he said. “And for the people who are deciding what books are selected, with the limited resources you have, it seems to me there are an awful lot of really excellent choices you could make in lieu of something like this.”
The definition of obscenity
The board was unable to answer one question posed multiple times that night: what is the distinction between sexual education material and pornography? When does that line get crossed?
“That’s a question about society and how society operates,” Blume said. “That’s not our turf…we’ve heard a few other folks say they want their kids to see it. We could not act in some moral censorship capacity if we start picking and choosing who gets to read any of our books without some general guidelines, as I mentioned, the American Library Association standards. If you want us to step in, by what standards? By whose?”
The Times-Record asked what ALA guidelines say to distinguish between pornography and sexual education? How do they define it?
Blume responded: “You’ll have to take it up with them.”
The Times-Record asked Blume if he was unfamiliar with the guidelines he professes to use.
Blume responded: “You are asking a question that is in the esoteric realm.”
Van Gijssel added: “This is a question we cannot answer, because it depends on your definition. We have our guidelines…our state librarian, can you chime in?”
Mary Soucie is the State Librarian for the State of North Dakota, participating in the board meeting remotely. Soucie admitted she also has not read the book – of those present on the board or among the staff, only two, Blume and Lloyd, admitted they’d seen the books contents.
“Regarding whether libraries censor… we don’t censor, we do make selection choices, because we have a budget … we work within what the community is asking for,” Soucie said. “You really don’t want the librarian to use their own personal standards.”
On the matter of standards, the state library does not have a standard definition for what qualifies as pornography.
“We do not have a definition of pornography in our collection development policy,” Soucie said. “I would go to the dictionary to look up the definition of pornography. When libraries select materials…there’s a process that we use, there’s reviews we read … and so I don’t have an answer for a definition between sexuality and pornography.”
It isn’t just the state. The American Library Association, whose guidelines the local library claims to follow, also has no set definition for what constitutes pornography.
”In fact, there is no legal definition of pornography - everyone has their own definition - so we look to the state statutes that identify what is obscene and unprotected and illegal,” Shawnda Hines, deputy director of communications for the ALA, told the TR in an email. “Normally, the threepart Miller test (U.S. Supreme Court case) is used to determine whether expression can be deemed obscene. Notably, that test requires the work to be evaluated as a whole and protects works with educational value or has social, political, scientific, artistic or literary value.”
The North Dakota century code on obscenity control offers some broad exceptions to the criminal liability in the distribution of obscene materials to minors to institutions like public libraries. It says the following:
“Sections (of the law) shall not apply to the possession or distribution of material in the course of law enforcement, judicial, or legislative activities; or to the possession of material by a bona fide school, college, university, museum or public library for limited access for educational research purposes carried on at such an institution by adults only.”
Whether the material within ‘Let’s Talk About It’ qualifies as obscenity is an unanswered question. The metric in the law refers to “contemporary North Dakota standards of decency” and the standard applies to material “taken as a whole, the average person … would find predominantly appeals to a prurient interest; depicts or describes in a patently offensive manner sexual conduct, whether normal or perverted; and taken as a whole, the reasonable person would find lacking in seriously literary, artistic, political or scientific value.”
Let’s Talk About It is now available at the library, with copies the board promises will be held in reserve, for the community to look at on their own time. Forms to request reconsideration of the book are also available online; all reconsideration requests will be discussed by the board at their next meeting, on October 20, 5:30 p.m. in the library’s lower level.