Hurling with a social history right there at your fingertips
Brian Carroll is revelling in the enormous success of the podcast ‘A Hurler’s Life’ as his labour of love passes 500,000 listeners
NOT for the first time, Brian Carroll has been posting numbers that he didn’t quite fully expect. The 3-15 that the former Offaly hurler notched for his club Coolderry in the county championship last weekend is one thing — especially at 38 years of age — but it’s the numbers attached to his hit podcast, ‘A Hurler’s Life’, that have been next level.
By the time Series 3 had wrapped up this season, he had broken the half-million listens mark.
The Soundcloud numbers which take into account Apple and all platforms bar Spotify were upwards of 275,000. Add in Spotify listens and the total is 520,000 across the 40 guests that have been featured so far in an idea sparked by lockdown.
A wonderful document of not just hurling history but social history. Listen to a rare interview with one of Offaly’s favourite sons John Troy describing a passion for local geography and place names, not to mention the ritual of the half-time cigarette and the story of the Tall Ships that impacted a trip to Croker.
Or Larry O’Gorman cheerfully recounting the full unedited version of his chance meeting
“People who’d never listened to podcasts would tune in”
with Muhammad Ali on the Wexford holiday after they won the 1996 All-Ireland. John Mullane diving beneath the hurling surface of a five-time All-Star career with Waterford to reveal his own deep spirituality.
The different hurling lives that span the length and breadth of the country, from Antrim’s Sambo McNaughton to Christy Walsh of Kerry.
Listen to Henry Shefflin with a delve into the psyche of a 10-time All-Ireland winner. His team-mate Jackie Tyrrell providing pearls of wisdom for aspiring young players; how to dedicate yourself to realise your full potential.
The carnage of each interviewee having to pick the ‘Best Six’ players that he played with – one for each line of the field. (As a sign of the fun and mayhem, Tyrrell left out Shefflin.)
There are coaching lessons, life lessons and hurling stories to beat the band along the way.
How it all came about that an RTÉ analyst whose day job as a secondary school Maths and PE teacher ended up with a top charting podcast? Turns out a line too can be drawn from Coolderry to Anfield.
‘I would have listened to Jamie Carragher’s ‘The Greatest Game’ on a couple of occasions,’ explains Carroll. ‘Similar type of thing. Interviewing players that he played against. I just thought this would be a great idea from a hurling perspective. I had a lightbulb
moment — what’s stopping me trying it? I went off and did my research, surveyed a good few people as to what they would be interested in listening to and came up with the format.
‘I just hit a perfect storm in terms of the timing with the first lockdown. It was a unique style of interview at that particular time. People who had never listened to podcasts before started to tune in because they had more time.
‘It was pretty easy to share it. That’s the beauty of social media nowadays. There’s a lot of mediums that are compatible.
‘And it is probably more accessible to older people than ever before. Because they’re a demographic that’s important.
‘I’d be very conscious of that,
that it’s free and accessible to everybody. It will never go behind a paywall.
‘I get huge enjoyment myself out of the conversations. I’m a fan of hurling, of all these players. Some I’ve played with or against; some I’ve looked up to.
‘I’d be very conscious that it’s an opportunity for people to hear about them. It’s why it’s called “A Hurler’s Life”. It’s a look at their lives as well outside hurling. What makes them the person they are.’
The joy of podcasting means the downloads can be mapped. He gives a sense of how far it has travelled.
‘You’re looking at more than 60 different countries. Obviously, wherever you have an Irish ex-pat. So you’ve got your usual — America, Australia, New Zealand — but you’re talking Singapore, Nepal – it’s crazy but you’ll always find an Irishman somewhere. Zambia,
Africa, Taiwan — all these different countries.’
It was a big leap from being an RTÉ analyst and featuring on other podcasts to producing one from start to finish. ‘It was a huge learning curve. Before, I was used to a microphone being shoved in front of my face and I just talked away and that’s it. I had to learn it from scratch. It’s a one-man band. People are very supportive and email in feedback, suggestions for guests. I reply to anyone who contacts me.’
Click on Spotify or whatever platform and there is hurling’s history at your fingertips. A slice of Irish life as much as sporting life. There’s a lovely,
social history element to it, when the three series are taken as a whole.
‘It’s documenting the last, what, four decades, of the history of hurling? It’s great to hear so many different perspectives, how the game has changed over that time. All the antics and everything else. Even Brian Whelahan’s story of being left behind in the Spa Hotel before the All-Ireland final in 1995. Having to get a taxi to the game. You can’t but mention the great Larry O. What a character. Some brilliant stories there.
‘When you have the likes of DJ Carey, Diarmuid O’Sullivan, Ken McGrath, Henry Shefflin willing to take the phonecall… it’s an honour. Sometimes I have to pinch myself.
‘Without them, there would be no show. The beauty of it is how relaxed they are, how much they are willing to put out there.’ As for breaking the half-million mark for listens? ‘Beyond anything I ever expected. I said I’d record four and see where it went. And if it didn’t take off, nothing ventured, nothing gained! But it took off.
‘For some, it’s getting stuff off their chests. Regrets, stuff like that. Picking their ‘Best Six’, carnage is the only word. I’ve had a couple not do the show because they don’t want to insult anyone.
‘You often get a sense of what values a player holds. For instance, some lads could pick a player who is an absolute workhorse, they’ll love that about him. Someone else will pick a pure hurler, a stickman. In its own sense, that
“People told me I’d never be as good as my father”
six tells you about the mentality of the player picking them.’
So what has he learned from talking to so many storied players? He found so many themes resonated with his own career.
With Coolderry he has county titles and a Leinster title, but the guts of 15 years as a free-scoring forward with Offaly coincided with a downturn in the county’s fortunes after the glorious decade of the 1990s and milestone decade of the 1980s, when his own late father Pat won two All-Irelands and two All-Stars before his
death in 1986 after an illness. So how much would family and his father have shaped his path, given how bound up he is in the modern history of Offaly hurling?
‘From my own perspective, having passed away he shaped a lot of how I went about my business. He had a huge influence. Not always positive, in terms of how much pressure I would have put on myself. My mother, and then later my wife Aisling, when she came into my life, had a huge positive impact in supporting and reassuring me.’
It gave him that bit of balance that so many of the players he talked to reference.
‘Most definitely. Growing up, maybe it was the older generation but I grew up being told by more people than not “sure you’ll never be as good as your father”.
‘When your dad dies at a young age and wins two All-Irelands and two All-Stars, he never hurled a bad game. And I mean that in the best way. When you’re told that when you’re young, it can eat away at you. And my career coincided then with a downturn for Offaly and for years it did eat me up that “I’m not going to achieve this.” I grew up wanting to win All-Irelands.
‘We had a successful underage club, won at minor with St Kieran’s [College]. I was used to playing at the top level and winning.
‘After a while it started eating me up that we weren’t going to win anything. Being realistic. We’re talking about going up against arguably the greatest Kilkenny team of all time. Even when we had a decent team, the chances were fairly slim.
‘But I had to get to a realisation that, “It’s okay – you just can’t do that.” I got that at the end of my career. I learned to enjoy it for what it is, the experience, and the journey. Then I got an Indian summer out my career in 2013, 14, 15.’
Was there a moment then when he made peace with his father’s legacy and his own All-Ireland ambitions?
‘Probably in 2013. I would have done a lot of work on that with a sports psychologist, just to try and give me that perspective. When I got that off my chest to a certain extent. Simple words then helped… “That’s okay”. Understanding that it’s not going to be possible to do it now. You have to make peace with that. That doesn’t make you a failure.
‘I can’t say every day has been plain sailing since but definitely I had a different outlook and I think my performances reflected that.’
When it came to the podcast, too, he made sure that it reflected the passion for the game across the country. ‘I tried to cover as many counties as possible.
‘There’s great people from around the country who have given their lives to the game. Christy Walsh in Kerry. Pat Critchley from Laois. Graham Clarke of Down. Sambo McNaughton of Antrim.
‘These men live and breathe hurling, often more so, because they have more adversity than someone winning five or six AllIrelands. There’s hurling people in all 32 counties. It’s important their stories are out there, too.’