A really good player is joining a really good team
It’s p otentially the worst-kep t secret in football right now. Kylian Mbap p e is only a few months away from p enning a deal with Real Madrid as a free agent, after informing Paris Saint-Germain earlier this season that he wouldn’t be extending his contract beyond this season. While we await formal communication from both the France cap tain and the 14-time UEFA Champ ions League winners, Soccer Laduma’s Kurt Buckerfield caught up with Londonborn Sp anish football exp ert Sid Lowe, who is based in Madrid, to understand the feeling in the country’s cap ital ahead of Mbap p e’s exp ected arrival. How will Mbap p e, Vinicius Junior and Rodrygo Goes all fit into the same team? How will the dressing room be imp acted? Lowe, author of the 2012 book Fear and Loathing in LALIGA: Barcelona vs Real Madrid, sets the scene.
On the questions surrounding Mbappe’s arrival…
The obvious thing, really, with Vinicius, Mbappe and Rodrygo, and it’s a recurring question, is where exactly do you put them? Because Real Madrid this season have already, I would say, had difficulties finding a natural place for Vinicius and Rodrygo because both of them prefer to play on the left. I say “on the left” but “on the left” is possibly not an entirely accurate way of putting it because they both play, of course, coming in from the left. So, their finishing point isn’t necessarily the left-hand side, but their starting point is the left-hand side. And they obviously do that in slightly different ways in that Vinicius is a bit more likely to go on the outside than diagonally, whereas Rodrygo is more likely to drifting inside thing. His movement is, I suppose, more horizontal than Vinicius. And then, of course, you’ve got Mbappe who plays as a forward, from the left as well. In terms of his movement and the spaces he occupies, I suppose there’s a combination of the two of them. Rodrygo has been open, which is unusual for a footballer I think, in saying he prefers to play from the left. And the reason I say it’s unusual is because when you start saying that it sounds like a complaint and managers tend not to like it. In Rodrygo’s case, saying that sounds like a challenge to Vinicius’ place and that’s obviously not always great. But I think it says something about the assuredness of the two of them, both Vinicius and Rodrygo, that Rodrygo feels like he can say that.
On the feeling in Spain that someone will need to leave…
I think what we’ve seen is (Carlo) Ancelotti trying to find a way of making the two of them fit together. If you look, for example, at the Manchester City game, he actually swapped their positions over almost because they sort of nominally both play up front, but Vinicius slightly to the left, Rodrygo slightly to the right and Bellingham going through the middle. In the first of the City games, you had Rodrygo going to the left and Vinicius in what I suppose you could almost call a full striker role. Coming into the middle and dropping off, trying to find space, but his starting point being the middle. And that actually worked reasonably well. And then there is the question of how Bellingham fits into all of this because he has been playing a lot of this season as that sort of full striker or as a free midfielder or as a No. 10 almost. But then in defensive phases of the game, playing on the left.
You’ve got this very, I would say, heavy loading of the team on the left-hand side. And yes, as your question suggests, that’s exactly where Mbappe would fit in. So, how do you resolve a question like this? Well, this is part of the discussion in Spain. What do you do with Mbappe when he comes? Because his position is currently occupied by just Vinicius, who is quite possibly the best player in the team, but by two of them. And I think that is quite important and significant. I think there are plenty of people in Spain who believe the conclusion to this is that someone gets sold. In fact, Predrag Mijatovic, who, of course, is a former Real Madrid player and former Sporting Director (2006-2009), works on the radio here in Spain and has said that he thinks someone has to go and the likelihood is that it will be Rodrygo. I don’t know that Madrid necessarily wants to sell anyone, but I think if they thought they could sell someone for good money and that it would be a nontraumatic departure… in other words, let’s say for argument’s sake you got 60 or 70 million euros for Rodrygo, you would almost be funding the Mbappe move. And I don’t think there is anyone really, despite the fondness for Rodrygo, who wouldn’t see that as an upgrade.
On how Mbappe fits in the dressing room…
I think there’s a little bit of a doubt about Mbappe’s fit in the dressing room as well in terms of personalities, but I think that’s just the natural doubt of the unknown. I don’t think that’s an actual doubt of talking about someone who is an absolute superstar, who has a social and political power within France, that can potentially be problematic. I think that one of the good things about this is that Real Madrid don’t have a bad dressing room at all. They don’t have particularly difficult characters in there. Even people like Vinicius, who, when you watch him, because of the way he plays, you can imagine him being arrogant, but he is not really. And of course, they have the ideal manager in terms of managing that kind of balance of the team. And I think that’s one of the things that they look at and think ‘This is a way through this’. There’s no doubt that there’s a question about the fit, there’s no doubt that it provides a degree of doubt in terms of how it all goes together, in terms of ‘could it be that this might not work?’ I think much more important is the sense of excitement. The sense of excitement that this team, that is absolutely walking the league this year, that’s now in the semi-finals of the UEFA Champions League, that has beaten Manchester City, has done it a year ahead of schedule, has done it at a time when everyone thought ‘there isn’t really a forward’. Now again, the question is: Is Mbappe really a forward? I think he can play there, but they’ve done it without him. And, more than anything else, there’s an excitement that says: ‘Bloody hell, this team is already really good and we’re about to add probably the best player in the world to it’. And, also by the way, they’re going to get him for free.
On Real Madrid finally landing PSG’s record scorer…
If you look at the way the narrative has been constructed and at the way Real Madrid have certainly tried to condition a narrative or encourage people to see it in a particular way, there’s no doubt Real Madrid are trying to make a point of having not just got their player but having won the fight as well. ‘We got him for free, PSG had to swallow’. I think there is partly a degree of frustration from Real Madrid that it has taken this long, and I think in a way they are trying to counter that through this construction of a story line and of a narrative, but I don’t think there’s any doubt that they look at this as ‘we won, we got the player, maybe later than we wanted, but we got him for free. PSG paid him an absolute fortune. Yes, we were made to look a little silly a few years ago, but now we’ve got him’.
So, for all the doubts about where he fits, there is a bottom line, which is another brilliant player is joining a really brilliant team and so I don’t think it’s a major concern. I also think if you look at the way it has been handled by Real Madrid, and if you look at PSG, there is a really truly simple answer to this question of where he fits, and it’s that Rodrygo plays right, Mbappe plays down the middle, Vinicius plays on the left. There’s a large degree of flexibility in that, there’s a great degree of movement between those players within those positions and that it all fits together. I think you’ve seen Luis Enrique change the way he uses Mbappe at times this season. He has used him as a No. 9, albeit with a degree of freedom of movement. The long and the short of it is, having gone around the houses, is that he is really good, and he is coming into a really good team and they’re going to win everything!
Tshepang Mailwane: Hello Elasto, thank you for making yourself available for this interview. A lot was said recently about you and your role at Moroka Swallows, following the exit of Steve Komphela a few months ago. Please give us details about what your role at Swallows is…
Elasto Kapowezha: How can I p ut this? It’s very broad when looking at what one does and where it all started. It might require me to go back, where I started at the club as a team manager in 2019. A team manager is someone who would form part of the supporting staff to the technical team and players. You are there to make sure that all the logistics are in place. You make sure things are in place when there is training, match preparation, travelling…all that fall within the duties and responsibilities of a team manager. So, that’s the basic team ma nager’s role, to make sure y ouarethereto provide and support the technical team an d the players’ needs, whether it’s matches or training. You make sure they are taken care of. I always say that when you are a team manat ager, you are the coach’s mercy. For me, things did change over a period of time.
TM: What is your title as we speak?
EK: I was appointed the General Manager of the club at the beginning of this season. It’s almost like you identify certain qualities an individual has and ambitions of what one wants to do. Then, it informs your superiors that there is more that this can bring to the club, rather than just limiting this person to those basic responsibilities of a team manager that I just mentioned. You end up being given these extra responsibilities, where for example you might be assigned the task of speaking to a player we want to bring to the club. A team manager normally doesn’t do that. So, I found myself being given these extra responsibilities because of what I was demonstrating. It culeventually minated in me being appointed General Manager. It is an acknowledgement for the work one does for the club, where you stretch yourself and do that without so many expectations. Just becoming somebody the club can make use of.
TM: There was an issue raised by Komphela about the delayed registration of Burkinabe midfielder Roland Sanou in the first half of the season. What was the issue there and what role did you play? EK: I think there were no issues. There are no issues with registration of players at Swallows. I am very much involved in the players that get registered at Swallows. They would come through me, and I would work with whoever that I am working with at the club to make sure that the right documentation is submitted. So, with Mr Roland Sanou, the issue at the time, which was picked up by myself, is that the permit came back with Swallows FC as the name of the employer. I realised that there was no way we could register this player under Swallows FC because we’ve moved away f rom Swallows FC. We are now trading as Moroka Swallows Football Club. I picked up that there was an error on the part of Home Affairs, and I straight away said: “There is no way I am going to submit a permit like this”. We had to reapply, and I said it does not matter how long it takes, as long as I have the right documentation to be able to register the player. That’s what happened. It took time, but it was worth the wait beyou’ve cause to make sure the documentation is above board when it comes to the registration of players.
TM: Was that properly communicated with then coach Komphela, because he spoke about it in public and sounded displeased with the whole situation of Sanou? EK:
I don’t think one would want to speak specifically about what would have happened in that moment with coach Steve. I want to talk about the work that I do and how I deal with coaches in general, without talking about my relationship or how it was with coach Steve. What I am prepared to say is that, with any coach, you would have that kind of communication. There is no way you could have a player training and the coach is unaware of what is happening, if he is registered or not. Generally, you would be discussing those matters with whichever coach.
TM: Did you ever feel like you were being blamed for Swallows’ problems,
especially with so much that was being said in the media?
EK:
No. What was in the media is something that’s there for public opinion. Most of the time it’s not factual. I feel that whatever is being said in the media is far from the truth in terms of what is really happening at the club. I’ve never felt like I am being blamed, because I would say blamed for what? It’s not the full truth as to what exactly is happening. People might not even understand what the role of a general manager is. But I never felt blamed because it’s just people who don’t understand what I do at the club.
TM: You speak of the full truth. What’s the full truth of what was happening at Swallows, particularly during the time when there were alleged strikes over monies?
EK:
It would be difficult for me to speak about those issues. I wanted to speak about my involvement and my role. The club has to be given that opportunity and, as I am speaking, the club will be able to come out at the right time to set the record straight on their part. At the moment, it’s the club that will get that opportunity to be able to speak, but it’s not in this interview where I can go into details about what transpired. I am not the right person. I will speak about myself and the role I have at the club.
TM: What role do you play in the recruitment of players?
EK:
I form part of a collective where things are discussed, especially from the technical team who would make recommendations. Once the club identifies a player they want, via the technical team, then my job is to make sure I go into
the market. Sometimes a player is wanted by two or more clubs, so you have to use your skills in terms of trying to bring that player to your club. You need to use your connections and everything that you can to make sure you deliver. I am very much involved in the club.
TM: With negative stories in the media about money and player strikes happening at the club, does it make it even harder to convince players to join Swallows?
EK:
It’s a yes and no. It’s about how you sell your vision to the player. It is how you present your case to the player. I was able to speak to a player like Keegan Allan. There were a few other clubs that wanted him and at times it’s better paying and bigger clubs than Swallows. I feel that there is always something you must bring to the player when you are speaking to them. You must show him things people might not see. There is always that selling point that I have when I am talking about the club to the players. It’s not everything that players read in the paper that’s negative. We had Monnapule Saleng on loan. From Swallows, he went back to Orlando Pirates, and he became a hot property. We had (Tshegofatso) Mabasa who came to Swallows, where nobody wanted him, even after playing in the COSAFA tournament. He comes to Swallows and revives his career. Now everyone wants Tshegofatso, and he is at the top of the rankings in terms of top goal scorer. Those are the kind of stories that you would sell to players who have doubts about joining Swallows. It’s not about everything they read in the media.
TM: Maybe just give us an example of what you’d say to a player…
EK:
I would not be able to give you everything because I am still going to talk to players. I can’t reveal my secret because it might be used by other competitors. It’s something I’ve had, talking to players when they come to the club and really looking at where they are. You must also look at where the player is. He might be at a low moment and then you bring that hope to that individual and show them players that have come here and have gone onto bigger and better things. Swallows is not a club where you come and end things. You should look ahead.
TM: Where do you think Swallows ranks in terms of player salaries in the PSL?
EK:
With the PSL, it’s not like overseas where these things are discussed openly. It becomes difficult for us to know what Golden Arrows is offering a player. Yes, we deal with agents who would tell us. But an agent is an agent. He might tell you that Black Leopards is offering 10 times more than what you are offering. So, you never know. But you also don’t want to make it a tug-of-war based on the money because you might say that the clubs that offer the highest must always get the players, but that’s not the case. There are other factors that you need to bring in and not necessarily look at how much you are going to get. It’s not so much about the money. You might not get the platform we are offering compared to a club that has more money. We work within a budget. There are times when you approach players, and you have an idea as to how far things might go because you would have done your research.
“I WANT TO TALK ABOUT WORK THAT THE DEAL I DO AND HOW WITH I COACHES WITHOUT IN GENERAL, MY TALKING ABOUT RELATIONSHIP OR HOW IT WAS WITH COACH STEVE.”
TM: Thank you so much for your time, Elasto.
EK:
I am grateful for being given the opportunity. Let’s touch base again. ❐