The Mail on Sunday

JUST DON’T MENTION THE KLOPP!

... but when it comes to following his German rival

- By Rob Draper CHIEF FOOTBALL WRITER

THOMAS TUCHEL is an urbane, affable and intelligen­t manager, part of an elite band of super coaches top clubs seek out when they need a fresh direction. Just don’t mention Jurgen Klopp. That’s the advice of Christian Heidel, managing director at FSV Mainz 05, who forged the German club’s rise from regional leagues to the Bundesliga and who gave both Klopp and Tuchel their big breaks.

Though Tuchel was not Klopp’s immediate successor at Mainz, only a year separated the end of the Liverpool manager’s reign there and the start of Tuchel’s ascent through the hierarchie­s of European football.

Tuchel, 47, was more successful at Mainz than Klopp, qualifying for the Europa League by finishing fifth in the Bundesliga and never lower than 13th. He then followed Klopp at Borussia Dortmund, where he couldn’t match hi s predecesso­r’s two Bundesliga titles and German Cup win, though he finished second and third and won the German Cup.

Still, the tension between the two was evident when Heidel brought the subject up in the summer of 2012, midway through Tuchel’s s pel l at Mainz.

Though t hey were performing better than ever, there was a sense many fans still yearned for the good old days of ‘ Kloppo’. It was partly because they had moved to a new stadium in 2011, a superb yet slightly-sterile facility called the Opel- Arena, a far cry from the atmospheri­c yet ramshackle city centre Bruchwegst­adion, where Klopp’s glory days had played out.

It was also because no one could match the charisma and energy of Klopp, his unique bond with fans and his popularity after 18 years as a player and manager at Mainz.

Though the new stadium was officially sold out and attendance­s cited as 34,000, there were thousands of empty seats. Season-ticket holders chose their matches; the sense of a city and club bound up as one wasn’t quite the same.

In trying to explain this, Heidel asked Tuchel what he thought his role was at the club. The manager replied that the coach’s only responsibi­lity should be to develop the team, win games and give fans value for money. Heidel, a gregarious figure himself, wanted to communicat­e to Tuchel that at Mainz there might be more to it.

‘I was saying that we, as a club, had to be a bit more engaging with our public,’ recalled Heidel. ‘Then a phrase slipped out and I said: “When Kloppo was here …” At that, Thomas let rip and shouted at me. What was I thinking? The conversati­on was over in that moment. And I thought, “Oops! I’ve obviously hit on a sore point”. He was really upset. That’s where the rivalry with Klopp stems from.’

Heidel tells the story in the recently published biography of new Chelsea manager Tuchel by Daniel Meuren and Tobias Schachter, soon to be published in English. Meuren, who covered Mainz as a journalist under Klopp and Tuchel, went into the project something of a sceptic, having experience­d Tuchel’s brusque manner compared with the avuncular Klopp, but came out with a deeper appreciati­on of Tuchel’s gifts.

‘Tuchel’s genius is the details,’ says Meuren. ‘He is t he coaches’ coach. In every session he is 105 per cent focused on what the players do.’

Training with tiny footballs, as Chelsea did on Friday, is pure Tuchel. He will mix up the colours of bibs in five-a-side so it’ s harder for players to remember who is on their team, forcing their brain to work harder. Repetition is the enemy. ‘Provocatio­n’ is his watchword, in the sense that he wishes constantly to challenge his players to problem solve. His obsession with detail may make him sound like an automaton but Meuren insists that isn’t the whole picture.

‘He has learned. He has spoken about how South American players might need physical touch, to be embraced or even kissed on the cheek. But in principle he will not change. Thomas is Thomas and that is his strength.’

When Meuren met Tuchel recently and told him he had grown to like him more since writing about him, Tuch el

His genius is in the details, challengin­g his players to problem solve

laughed and was pleased that the more you get to know him, the more you appreciate him.

And time has mellowed Tuchel. Back when he exploded at Heidel, he was a trying to make his way, working in the shadow of Klopp, one of the great personalit­ies.

Now he has that German Cup success, two French league titles with Paris Saint- Germain, a French cup and a Champions League final under his belt.

Still, having followed Klopp to the Premier League, he once again invites comparison.

‘It’s hard to be as successful as Jurgen but we will try hard, of course,’ he said on Thursday, when he spoke via Zoom to journalist­s for an hour. He did so with wit and considerab­le energy. Even if he cannot match the trademark Klopp beaming smile and hearty laugh, he is no mere technocrat. The Klopp question raised no hackles this time.

‘Jurgen is one of the very best coaches, one of the most fascinatin­g personalit­ies out there as a coach. Of course, we have a certain history [but] we don’t know each other as well as everybody thinks. But every time we meet, it’s amazing. He is a fantastic personalit­y and a super funny guy.

‘People love him, fans love him, his team loves him and he has the results for it. Let’s try to make things a bit more complicate­d for him. We start now, to close the gap, to take away a bit of his points and his reputation, with all respect and friendship, of course.’

Tuchel has had to change from the intense bright young thing he was at Mainz, maturing into a more worldly Euro coach.

He was an even more modest player than Klopp. Tuchel played in the third tier at Ulm in BadenWurtt­emberg, south west Germany. He c a me u n d e r the influence of Ralf Rangnick, who pioneered the new wave of German tactics, a huge influence on Klopp. Tuchel’s break at Mainz came after he had impressed looking after Augsburg’s reserve team, where he coached Julian Nagelsmann, current coach of RB Leipzig and next German most likely to end up in England, giving him his first scouting jobs.

In 2008, Tuchel was invited to take the Mainz A Team, the equivalent of Premier League Under 23s. He made an impression on the young players, though his work ethic and abrupt tone did lead a delegation to approach him mid-season to ask him to go easier on them. He did, and they ended up reaching the play- off final, which decides the winner of the A-team league. Tuchel was a master at persuading young players to buy into a shared vision. On a pre- season trip to Austria, the team mountain-biked to an Alpine s ummit. He gat hered t hem around and solemnly buried a Mainz pin badge in the ground.

‘This is our treasure,’ he told them. ‘When we win a trophy this s eason, we’ll return to dig it up!’

When the team qualified for the final, Tuchel decided he needed the badge as a prop f or hi s t eam t alk. For t he sake of authentici­ty he drove four hours to Austria, climbing the mountain and recovering the original one which they had buried. He did so in secret and then, as the team waited to leave the dressing room, produced it.

‘This is our treasure!’ he told the team, recounting his trip to Austria. ‘We kept our promise. We brought the pin badge back to you. Now go and complete our dream by winning the title!’

It had the desired effect. Mainz beat Borussia Dortmund in a play-off final in front of 10,000 fans at their old Bruchwegst­adion. Among the spectators was Klopp, by then in charge of Dortmund’s senior team.

Sat next to his old friend Heidel, Klopp observed: ‘Today the best team beat the team with 10 better players (Andre Schurrle, a future World Cup winner with Germany, was the only Mainz player Klopp had rated better than his Dortmund youngsters).’

‘His words were huge praise for Tuchel,’ said Heidel, who had already noted the potential in his academy manager. Hoffenheim tried to poach him mid-season and double his salary, but Heidel wrote an impassione­d email to

Tuchel, telling him to stay and one day become first-team coach.

It came just prior to the 2009-10 season, when Tuchel was offered the chance to become the youngest coach in the Bundesliga at 36.

‘Thomas requested a couple of weeks to think about it,’ recalled Heidel. ‘I made clear to him that in football business, that’s not possible. Especially as a promoted team five days before the start of the season. I said it was probably a once-in-a-lifetime opportunit­y.’

Tuchel finished ninth in his first season then fifth, qualifying for the Europa League. Players and journalist­s recall the intensity he always brought.

‘ Who is not [ intense] at this level?’ said Tuchel on Thursday. ‘I found some days ago some of the speeches I gave in the dressing room at Mainz. I was laughing aloud, a bit shocked. “Did I say this? Wow! Did I dare say this?”

‘In the end, it was authentic, it was me in this moment and this is what I am all about. I can only be myself. Anything else you will feel “Ah, he’s holding something back” or “he wants to be funny but he’s not in the mood today” or “he wants to pretend to be angry but he’s not really a n g r y ” . Yo u feel it. In the end, of course, it was intense [at Mainz].’

The question is whether the man who at Dortmund fell out with his chief executive Hans- Joachim Watzke and chief scout Sven Mislintat, and then with his sporting director Leonardo at PSG, is ready for the political minefield that awaits him at Chelsea.

‘I have changed,’ he said. ‘You cannot stay the same guy. That would be horrible. I am now 47. I don’t want to be the same guy I was at 35. Hopefully I learn every day and, of course, every player needs to be treated differentl­y. Neymar needs a special bond, special treatment, but so does Thiago Silva, so does Mason Mount, so does Callum HudsonOdoi and so does Billy Gilmour.

‘Some need a hug, some need you to push them hard and in the end I believe you can be honest, give your opinion and it stays in the dressing room. This is not a one-way street I can handle also the truth and opinion and I can handle honest feedback. For sure I developed.’

At that he paused, reflected and added: ‘Let’s see what you say about me after some time.’

I found some of the speeches I gave at Mainz. How I laughed... but we change

 ?? ?? STRAIGHT TO WORK: Tuchel gives pointers to his Chelsea players
STRAIGHT TO WORK: Tuchel gives pointers to his Chelsea players
 ?? ?? HEAD TO HEAD: Tuchel and Klopp in 2010
HEAD TO HEAD: Tuchel and Klopp in 2010

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