Johnson skeptical of background check laws
Senator questions effectiveness of measures
MADISON - U.S. Sen. Ron Johnson questioned the effectiveness of expanded background checks for gun purchases, said state red-flag laws should be tightly limited and expressed skepticism toward banning more rapid-fire weapons.
In a lengthy interview Wednesday, the Republican from Oshkosh raised questions about how much the federal government can do to prevent mass shootings like the ones that killed 31 people over the weekend in Ohio and Texas.
“The vast majority of purchases go through that background check,” Johnson said. “Let me point out: It hasn’t prevented these tragedies, has it? So, I don’t think Washington has a whole lot of solutions in terms of this particular problem.”
President Donald Trump — who on Wednesday visited El Paso, Texas, and Dayton, Ohio — in recent days has called for expanded background checks and a federal red-flag law, though he has been short on specifics.
Johnson, the chairman of the Senate Homeland Security Committee, said he’d rather put the focus on making school buildings safer and giving police officers easier access to health and school records.
He acknowledged that protecting schools is easier to do than protecting other public places, such as the Walmart and entertainment district where the weekend shootings occurred.
“It’s hard to protect people in an open society without becoming a police state,” he said. “There’s the trade-off. … Security or freedom. And (if) you sacrifice both, you get neither.”
But U.S. Rep. Gwen Moore, a Democrat from Milwaukee, said Congress can and should act to curb gun violence. In a statement, she called for universal background checks and a ban on socalled assault weapons.
“Americans deserve to feel safe throughout their daily lives,” she said in her statement. “Families shouldn’t be afraid to go to movie theaters. Children shouldn’t be afraid to go to school.”
Johnson cast doubts about expanding background checks. He voted against such legislation in 2013. He missed a vote on the issue in 2015 but said at the time he opposed the idea.
“I’ll consider pieces of legislation when it’s before me but I voted no in the past because my evaluation is I just really don’t think it’s going to move the needle in terms of effectiveness,” Johnson said Wednesday. “I’m a strong defender of Second Amendment rights and I’m not really looking to water those things down to pass laws that really are ineffective.”
Radcliffe Haughton in 2012 killed his estranged wife, Zina Daniel Haughton,
two others and himself at the Azana Salon & Spa in Brookfield. He could not legally buy a gun because of a restraining order but was able to avoid a background check by purchasing a gun the day before the shooting through an online marketplace.
But Johnson said extending background checks to online purchases might not have stopped those murders.
“Not necessarily,” he said. “Do you think a determined domestic terrorist is going to be deterred by laws? They’re already violating the laws. That’s kind of the false part of the argument.”
Johnson has received $1.3 million in help from the National Rifle Association over his political career. That’s the 17th highest amount for current members of the Senate and House, according to data from the Center for Responsive Politics, which tracks political spending.
Trump in recent days has promoted red-flag laws like those in more than a dozen states that allow courts to temporarily take away guns from people who they deem dangerous. Johnson signaled support for a federal grant program for states that have such laws but said the laws should be limited to make sure no one’s weapons are taken away without justification.
“Any time you do something like this, it should be an extreme case like involuntary commitment is right now,” he said.
He declined to say whether Wisconsin should adopt a red-flag law, saying it was up to state officials. Democratic Gov. Tony Evers has backed the idea and Republicans who control the Legislature have opposed it.
Johnson cast doubt on a ban on what critics call assault weapons. He called the term ill-defined and noted automatic weapons and bump stocks that allow guns to be fired faster are already banned. He questioned whether limits should be put on the sale of semi-automatic weapons.
The Dayton shooter killed nine people in 30 seconds and was then killed by police. But Johnson expressed opposition to limiting more rapid-firing weapons, saying bad actors could kill large numbers of people in other ways.
“You can create a lot of carnage with not using a gun,” Johnson said. “People attack crowds with trucks.”
Johnson said one of the best responses to mass shootings is to take recommendations from commissions that have studied school shootings. He praised Wisconsin officials for adopting a measure last year that gave schools $100 million to upgrade their buildings.
He said schools should make common-sense changes like having a single entrance, ensuring their doors are locked during school hours, rehearsing responses to intruders and ensuring communications devices work across jurisdictions.
He called the costs to school districts minimal and said the federal government shouldn’t help cover security improvements.
“The federal government is already running a deficit of a trillion dollars,” he said. “Where are you going to get the money?”
But U.S. Rep. Mark Pocan, a Democrat from rural Dane County, said background checks and a ban on high-capacity magazines are more important than fortifying schools.
“When I’ve spoken to students in Wisconsin, they don’t want their schools to look like prisons,” he said in a statement. “They want Congress to pass gun control reform now.”
Johnson backs legislation that would set up a “clearinghouse for best practices” to show law enforcement and school officials how to prevent and respond to mass shootings.
He also called for changes to privacy laws to make it easier for law enforcement to get school and health records. That would help ensure information turns up when background checks are done, he said.
Democrats have accused Trump of inspiring mass killers, with Moore saying this week that Trump was “complicit” in the El Paso shooting by referring to illegal immigration as an “invasion” and making a joke when someone at his rally suggested shooting immigrants.
Johnson criticized both sides for their political discourse but did not single out Trump.
“I don’t like the tone across the political spectrum,” Johnson said. “We ought to turn it down a number of notches and focus on solving these problems. There’s plenty of blame to be spread around with incorrect tone and politicization of things.”
Past shootings have shocked the country but led to little action from Congress. Johnson said he didn’t know if the most recent shootings would be any different.
“I can’t predict it,” he said. “I would say the immediate politicization of these tragedies is not a good sign.”